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Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 4:50 pm
by IlluminEddie
sward wrote:evenslow wrote:IlluminEddie wrote:Anyway, The Ten Club could’ve handled digital sales.
This invalidates the rest of your argument.
I tried reading through each the arguments but man, I didnt realize how bad my attention span was until I tried. Probably should go back and re-read it before I offer ANY viewpoint. But I believe, truly believe that the band has altered the way it 'sells' things in order to compensate for the decrease in album sales/royalties and to allow themselves to maintain whatever lifestyle they earned from the beginning.
That said. There is zero wrong with that. I can't walk out the door today and decide I can take a job that pays me 40% of what it used to. Can't do it. I'll take whatever job allows me to maintain my lifestyle and hopefully one that gives back to me as well somehow.
I also believe that the band allocates number of dollars from said earnings towards various charities or foundations and would like to be able to do that as well as continue to live their lives as they have been for 20 years and with that, I am comfortable with whatever route they take to sell it. Its just as easy to see their partnership with Target as all greed since Target, on the surface is the sort of corporation they railed against early on. But you could also try to dig deeper and find out that aligning with Target allowed them to recoup their costs for the album, put some in the bank as well as have a portion go towards whatever philanthropic endeavor they choose.
All good in my books.
It's tough to track the discussion via quotes and whatnot, I get that. But, mainly it's been a discussion between myself and stip. So, I understand why you're having trouble following it. It's been ongoing and I dropped the quotes because it was a pain to use them last time.
Let me clarify a few things. I think it's fine that they did what they did with Target. I simply think they are a bit hypocritical for doing that given what they've said about corporations, commercial endorsements (Adam Duritz like comments) and greed. That's all. It's not solely Target affiliation which makes me believe they are hypocritical.
Target was one example. The primary discussion revolves around whether Ed (PJ) is a hypocrite. I think he is. I offered loads of alternative examples of him (PJ) being hypocritical in the thread if you don't like the Target one.
P.S. I think making money and putting it away is smart. I don't really have a problem with average corporations. I would never say I did. I just think rallying against haves and have nots and corporate interests when you're a "have" and your doing all these monetary ties to corporate entities when you don't have to to ensure you keep making more money ... seems... hypocritical. All he has to do is stop blabbing, really.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 4:54 pm
by Lounge Lizard
Move on
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 4:54 pm
by harmless
Thing is, though, the Target example was like the epitome of hypocricy for a lot of people; pretty much as bad as it gets. So if you don't take that argument re. Target, you can pretty much put it down as a blanket issue. Pearl Jam have grown and changed their mind, developed a more holistic and realistic view, and worked out how to be in the world but not of it, to use religious language, and still do what they do. That's it.
But yeah, move on.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 4:58 pm
by Lounge Lizard
I'm having red cabernet wine, cheese, grapes and walnuts.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 5:00 pm
by EJ
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 5:07 pm
by harmless
Lounge Lizard wrote:I'm having red cabernet wine, cheese, grapes and walnuts.

Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 6:17 pm
by Lament
gems and rhinestones wrote:Lament wrote:
Oh man. Don't even get me started on Lauren Mayberry. If I hadn't seen her in person I would be convinced her existence was just a mean trick someone was playing on me.
Pearl Jam should have just put a picture of her for the artwork and I would have been just fine with it. I'm seeing her September 13th!
Excellent! I'm seeing them the 10th and 11th. I saw them at the Mercury Lounge in March and it was one of the best shows I've seen in ages. You won't be disappointed. They definitely live up to all of the hype.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 6:34 pm
by Jorge
She's real pretty but I feel like her voice is too small for that song.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 6:40 pm
by E.H. Ruddock
EJ wrote:
STOP SHOOTING MATT!
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 6:42 pm
by Lounge Lizard
E.H. Ruddock wrote:EJ wrote:
STOP SHOOTING MATT!
see, even the clip director says bring back Jack Irons
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 6:43 pm
by Lament
(I started a CHVRCHES thread in Other Bands so we don't take up real estate in this thread any longer)
http://forums.theskyiscrape.com/viewtop ... f=6&t=1948
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 7:45 pm
by stip
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 7:56 pm
by stip
IlluminEddie wrote:hy•poc•ri•sy
hiˈpäkrisēSubmit
noun
1.
the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense.
stip wrote:The problem with the way people misuse the word hypocrisy is that they do not account for the fact that people's views may change over time as they discover new information, have different experiences, re-contextualize the old, etc. That's called learning, changing your mind, growing up, being wrong, etc. You become a hypocrite if you continue to publicly affirm one set of values while your behavior undermines those values. Eddie doesn't become a hypocrite if you can no longer hold him to things he said 5, 10, 15 years ago. He may be more or less admirable as a result, but that's not hypocrisy.
IlluminEddie wrote: As for time, I see no mention of time in the definition of above. I certainly agree one can change. I disagree that stip decides that time and whether one does or does not live up to the definition.
stip wrote:thats because you didn't quote the whole thing
IlluminEddie wrote:I did quote the entire definition hypocrisy. Go to google. Type in the word. Look at what pops up. You’ll see the entire definition I posted. There’s no mention of time, nor is there mention of stip making the call on what time’s appropriate.
Guys, this is starting to feel wrong
stip wrote:i voted for Nader in 2000 and did not vote for him in 2004. Am I a hypocrite too?
IlluminEddie wrote:
Did you stand on a soapbox for an entire tour or three preaching about third parties and their importance, then bail on that thought completely?
stip wrote:
Like most people who vote for a third party, I’m sure I was an insufferable self righteous prig about it for a while. And then I decided that it was more important to me to stop Bush than support Nader, and that my time would be better spent trying to make the democratic party more liberal than push for a third party that did not have a large enough mass base to do anything beyond throw an election to the party I usually despise.
IlluminEddie wrote:
You didn’t “stop Bush”, superhero. He served two terms.
stip wrote:
actually, working in conjunction with pearl jam, I did. But then Bush offered to pay us a LOT of money if we'd let him be president anyway. I said no, but you know pearl jam and money...
IlluminEddie wrote:Bush served two terms.
Yeah, I don’t think I can be a part of this anymore. There’s pretty much no way to read this that won’t make me feel bad about continuing this exchange.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 7:56 pm
by Strat
Would you 2 knock it off? Thanks.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 7:58 pm
by Lounge Lizard
Strat wrote:Would you 2 knock it off? Thanks.
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 8:20 pm
by stip
In conclusion, Libya is a land of contrasts
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 8:22 pm
by EJ
stip wrote:In conclusion, Libya is a land of contrasts
Well done, Bart.

Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Tue August 27, 2013 11:20 pm
by Sgt. Crackpot
stip wrote:Blah blah blah blah.
IlluminEddie wrote:Blah blah blah blah.
- Spoiler: show

Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Wed August 28, 2013 7:44 am
by Lounge Lizard
MYM loses badly in a fan vote contest vs some mainstreamish linkin-park-limp-bizkit-korn-sound-alike terrible number by a band I've never heard about and not going to ever listen to:
http://loudwire.com/afi-vs-pearl-jam-cage-match/
Re: Mind Your Manners
Posted: Wed August 28, 2013 7:49 am
by Lament
You've never heard of AFI?