Red Mosquito

Yeah, sorry

This is getting so much better with each listen

I have confirmation that Ed goes as high as B4 on that live version of Infallible. There are G4s, A4s and some of them are between Bb4/B4 but only once does he hit exactly B4. I suspect the studio version goes a tad higher or maybe has more B4s. Either way, it's extremely impressive for a baritone to sing that high so cleanly, using his upper chest register.

This is so funny.
I was really disappointed with the vocal part when I first heard it.
I thought - oh man, with a riff like that it could have been so much more better.
But you know - I can't stop listening to it now
With each listen it becomes... better somehow?

I went fishing yesterday and today, and 'Infallible' was inside my head all this time.
I can't hearing those lines:

Keep on locking your doors
Keep on building your floors
Keep on just as before


and


Of everything that's possible
In the hears and minds of men
Somehow it is the biggest things
That keep on slipping right through our hands
By thinking we're infallible
We're only tempting fate instead

It's time we just began
Right at the ending


so good
so so good
I'm loving it.

Its been in my head since i woke up this morning

Lounge Lizard wrote:This is so funny.
I was really disappointed with the vocal part when I first heard it.
I thought - oh man, with a riff like that it could have been so much more better.
But you know - I can't stop listening to it now
With each listen it becomes... better somehow?

I went fishing yesterday and today, and 'Infallible' was inside my head all this time.
I can't hearing those lines:

Keep on locking your doors
Keep on building your floors
Keep on just as before


and


Of everything that's possible
In the hears and minds of men
Somehow it is the biggest things
That keep on slipping right through our hands
By thinking we're infallible
We're only tempting fate instead

It's time we just began
Right at the ending


so good
so so good
I'm loving it.

Somehow I knew you'd come around to this one.

sorry for typos

'I can't hearing these lines' is obviously 'I KEPT hearing those lines'.

And I don't think I mentioned the bridge.
So glad they decided to not do a solo.
It's great this way.
The 'ah-ah's in the second half of the bridge are wonderful

harmless wrote: Somehow I knew you'd come around to this one.

so... you've been thinking about me?

Lounge Lizard wrote:

harmless wrote: Somehow I knew you'd come around to this one.

so... you've been thinking about me?

Weeeell I have two lounge lizards, so..

harmless wrote:Well, two takeaways from that post: there's still no reason they can't record a song in a manageable key. And Ed is no Jeff Buckley.

A better comparison would be other great bands that tune their songs down live so that their vocalist could sing them. That would interest me to know, as I haven't heard of that happening beyond Pearl Jam.

Buckley and Mercury were great singers, much more technically skilled than Ed, but their studio performances were rarely equalled live. Mercury was known to chicken out on most of the high notes live. Buckley's control on high notes live was suspect. Ed's actually been a very consistently good live singer through most of his career. The fact that PJ songs aren't as difficult as Queen's material or Buckley's however makes that comparison misleading. The actual point was that singers with more skill than Ed have not replicated studio songs live so thinking Ed shouldn't give it his all in studio for fear of not being able to replicate it live is bollocks.

MFS sounds way better on the album than on it's live debut where I can only assume they downtuned it because Ed wasn't feeling 100%. He was singing Infallible fine the night before which is way more difficult. MYM wasn't downtuned when they played it earlier and it's tougher to sing than MFS.

A song should be recorded in the key where it sounds best. How it is performed live depends on other factors such as how long the band is touring, what the state of the vocalist's throat is, how often they have to perform, etc. There's nothing on LB except Infallible or maybe MYM for which Ed would need to alter his delivery in order to maintain his voice through a tour.

Regarding other bands downtuning their songs live, the list is endless. U2, Metallica, Bon Jovi, Tesla, Def Leppard, Dio, The Who, Whitesnake, etc. It just has to be done if you don't want the vocalist burned out before the end of the tour. Or if you plan on lasting a few decades rather than a few years.

Thanks, that's informative

Release_Me wrote:

harmless wrote:Well, two takeaways from that post: there's still no reason they can't record a song in a manageable key. And Ed is no Jeff Buckley.

A better comparison would be other great bands that tune their songs down live so that their vocalist could sing them. That would interest me to know, as I haven't heard of that happening beyond Pearl Jam.

Buckley and Mercury were great singers, much more technically skilled than Ed, but their studio performances were rarely equalled live. Mercury was known to chicken out on most of the high notes live. Buckley's control on high notes live was suspect. Ed's actually been a very consistently good live singer through most of his career. The fact that PJ songs aren't as difficult as Queen's material or Buckley's however makes that comparison misleading. The actual point was that singers with more skill than Ed have not replicated studio songs live so thinking Ed shouldn't give it his all in studio for fear of not being able to replicate it live is bollocks.

MFS sounds way better on the album than on it's live debut where I can only assume they downtuned it because Ed wasn't feeling 100%. He was singing Infallible fine the night before which is way more difficult. MYM wasn't downtuned when they played it earlier and it's tougher to sing than MFS.

A song should be recorded in the key where it sounds best. How it is performed live depends on other factors such as how long the band is touring, what the state of the vocalist's throat is, how often they have to perform, etc. There's nothing on LB except Infallible or maybe MYM for which Ed would need to alter his delivery in order to maintain his voice through a tour.

Regarding other bands downtuning their songs live, the list is endless. U2, Metallica, Bon Jovi, Tesla, Def Leppard, Dio, The Who, Whitesnake, etc. It just has to be done if you don't want the vocalist burned out before the end of the tour. Or if you plan on lasting a few decades rather than a few years.

awesome post - i'm starting to sound like a Release_Me fanboy but these insights are great.

I guess I feel that I don't mind the band tuning these songs down as much, because I love the songs. That's pretty telling; it seemed worse during the Backspacer tour because I just wasn't so into the songs.

Release_Me wrote:

harmless wrote:Well, two takeaways from that post: there's still no reason they can't record a song in a manageable key. And Ed is no Jeff Buckley.

A better comparison would be other great bands that tune their songs down live so that their vocalist could sing them. That would interest me to know, as I haven't heard of that happening beyond Pearl Jam.

Buckley and Mercury were great singers, much more technically skilled than Ed, but their studio performances were rarely equalled live. Mercury was known to chicken out on most of the high notes live. Buckley's control on high notes live was suspect. Ed's actually been a very consistently good live singer through most of his career. The fact that PJ songs aren't as difficult as Queen's material or Buckley's however makes that comparison misleading. The actual point was that singers with more skill than Ed have not replicated studio songs live so thinking Ed shouldn't give it his all in studio for fear of not being able to replicate it live is bollocks.

MFS sounds way better on the album than on it's live debut where I can only assume they downtuned it because Ed wasn't feeling 100%. He was singing Infallible fine the night before which is way more difficult. MYM wasn't downtuned when they played it earlier and it's tougher to sing than MFS.

A song should be recorded in the key where it sounds best. How it is performed live depends on other factors such as how long the band is touring, what the state of the vocalist's throat is, how often they have to perform, etc. There's nothing on LB except Infallible or maybe MYM for which Ed would need to alter his delivery in order to maintain his voice through a tour.

Regarding other bands downtuning their songs live, the list is endless. U2, Metallica, Bon Jovi, Tesla, Def Leppard, Dio, The Who, Whitesnake, etc. It just has to be done if you don't want the vocalist burned out before the end of the tour. Or if you plan on lasting a few decades rather than a few years.

I think down tuning, especially at 40+, is a rule more than it is an exception. There's another thing that speaks in Ed's favour. Those are above average long shows he sings every night. If i remember correctly they down tune songs that are potentially damaging for his voice rather than difficult per se, I'm thinking they usually feature screaming or distorted high parts.
Mentioning Mercury made me think of something they used to do. Some singers recorded vocals 1/2 step lower compared to the original key and the vocals were then sped up to match it. Mercury did it too if remember correctly.

Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:This is getting so much better with each listen

ditto

If this chorus is as great live as I'm imagining it will be (this weekend in Brooklyn) then Infallible may jump from a 4 to a 5 for me. The lyrics are really solid on this one. The biggest improver since the first few listens.

bluestate wrote:

Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:This is getting so much better with each listen

ditto

i put it as equal with yellow moon for my #2 this morning, but i think it might be there by itself really

Numero uno.

Release_Me wrote:

harmless wrote:Well, two takeaways from that post: there's still no reason they can't record a song in a manageable key. And Ed is no Jeff Buckley.

A better comparison would be other great bands that tune their songs down live so that their vocalist could sing them. That would interest me to know, as I haven't heard of that happening beyond Pearl Jam.

Buckley and Mercury were great singers, much more technically skilled than Ed, but their studio performances were rarely equalled live. Mercury was known to chicken out on most of the high notes live. Buckley's control on high notes live was suspect. Ed's actually been a very consistently good live singer through most of his career. The fact that PJ songs aren't as difficult as Queen's material or Buckley's however makes that comparison misleading. The actual point was that singers with more skill than Ed have not replicated studio songs live so thinking Ed shouldn't give it his all in studio for fear of not being able to replicate it live is bollocks.

MFS sounds way better on the album than on it's live debut where I can only assume they downtuned it because Ed wasn't feeling 100%. He was singing Infallible fine the night before which is way more difficult. MYM wasn't downtuned when they played it earlier and it's tougher to sing than MFS.

A song should be recorded in the key where it sounds best. How it is performed live depends on other factors such as how long the band is touring, what the state of the vocalist's throat is, how often they have to perform, etc. There's nothing on LB except Infallible or maybe MYM for which Ed would need to alter his delivery in order to maintain his voice through a tour.

Regarding other bands downtuning their songs live, the list is endless. U2, Metallica, Bon Jovi, Tesla, Def Leppard, Dio, The Who, Whitesnake, etc. It just has to be done if you don't want the vocalist burned out before the end of the tour. Or if you plan on lasting a few decades rather than a few years.

Im such a lamen when it comes to this stuff so please humor me...

when you say "downtune" - i get that it means lower key which equal easier to match as a singer... but as a listener : \

how obvious was downtuning for MSF the other night?

And as a singer, if he sang at a lower key with the rest of the song remaining at the studio level - how bad would it sound?

Thanks

I'm not sure if it's just that it's more layered than many of the other songs but the song feels a lot more squeezed and compressed than much of the rest of the album. It's kind of a drag to listen to on good headphones.

I'm also not really sold on the effected sound of Matt's snare on this one, I think a more natural THWOCK would've worked better.