The U.S. has two major data collection programs: the Uniform Crime Reports from the FBI and the National Crime Victimization Survey from the Bureau of Justice Statistics. You’ll have to ask them.
Speaking of the FBI report, an aside: one reason that increases in crime are usually framed as happening “in cities” is because larger metros have the infrastructure and personnel to collect and report these figures, while the FBI has to collate data from most smaller communities on its own. The report that incorporates the collated data usually arrives some months after the metros report, by which time the conversation is over.
Which is why we talk about homicides being up in big cities in 2020, even though communities with fewer than 10,000 residents saw more than a 30 percent increase in killings as well.
On the 1% stat …. Ok thanks? I know for a fact that store owners have stopped reporting thefts because they know no arrests will be made, and that fewer arrests are being made because the cops are disheartened that the city attorneys will just let the perps right back out again. So that 1% stat is waaaayyyy off. It’s much higher in reality.
On the murders … yeah everyone is fucking crazy. We have competing extremists out here and no more appetite as a country for reasonable middle-ground debate and/or compromise. AKA common fucking sense.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:47 am
by simple schoolboy
No one posted the pit manuever video?
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:40 am
by verb_to_trust
Bammer wrote:
McParadigm wrote:
Bammer wrote:What is that 1% uptick in Seattle?
Number of reported crimes?
Number of arrests for such crimes?
The U.S. has two major data collection programs: the Uniform Crime Reports from the FBI and the National Crime Victimization Survey from the Bureau of Justice Statistics. You’ll have to ask them.
Speaking of the FBI report, an aside: one reason that increases in crime are usually framed as happening “in cities” is because larger metros have the infrastructure and personnel to collect and report these figures, while the FBI has to collate data from most smaller communities on its own. The report that incorporates the collated data usually arrives some months after the metros report, by which time the conversation is over.
Which is why we talk about homicides being up in big cities in 2020, even though communities with fewer than 10,000 residents saw more than a 30 percent increase in killings as well.
On the 1% stat …. Ok thanks? I know for a fact that store owners have stopped reporting thefts because they know no arrests will be made, and that fewer arrests are being made because the cops are disheartened that the city attorneys will just let the perps right back out again. So that 1% stat is waaaayyyy off. It’s much higher in reality.
On the murders … yeah everyone is fucking crazy. We have competing extremists out here and no more appetite as a country for reasonable middle-ground debate and/or compromise. AKA common fucking sense.
McMediadigm is busy combing the internet newsy news for his embedded response.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 6:10 am
by simple schoolboy
Crime victim surveys are useful now? I thought they were totally disproven by lenny's stats.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 3:27 pm
by McParadigm
Bammer wrote:On the 1% stat …. Ok thanks? I know for a fact that store owners have stopped reporting thefts because they know no arrests will be made, and that fewer arrests are being made because the cops are disheartened that the city attorneys will just let the perps right back out again. So that 1% stat is waaaayyyy off. It’s much higher in reality.
That’s an honest shame, because even if they don’t get prosecuted those theft reports do inform the above-mentioned crime statistics. If police reforms being enacted in Seattle or Washington ever get reversed, it will be because those statistics changed for the worse…not because someone knows for a fact that it’s secretly happening.
By not reporting, those people are shooting themselves in the foot. Their decision not to report prevents their advocates from being able to **demonstrate the problem through those reports.** It’s like hiding evidence that supports your case from your own lawyer.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:26 pm
by verb_to_trust
Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:36 pm
by Rob
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:47 pm
by verb_to_trust
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Answer my question
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:48 pm
by Rob
verb_to_trust wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Answer my question
If they care about what’s happening to them, they should alert the proper authorities. You can’t do nothing about it and whine.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:52 pm
by elliseamos
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Answer my question
If they care about what’s happening to them, they should alert the proper authorities. You can’t do nothing about it and whine.
well...
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:53 pm
by Rob
elliseamos wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Answer my question
If they care about what’s happening to them, they should alert the proper authorities. You can’t do nothing about it and whine.
well...
To be clear I’m referring to Bammer’s “people get robbed and don’t report” argument. Not victims of crime in general.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:54 pm
by verb_to_trust
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Answer my question
If they care about what’s happening to them, they should alert the proper authorities. You can’t do nothing about it and whine.
But if you know all you are doing is sending data into the bureaucracy that allowed lawlessness in the first place would you really feel like that would be a worthwhile use of your time?
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:57 pm
by elliseamos
verb_to_trust wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:
Rob wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Do you think a victim of crime cares about reports and future good of society more or getting restitution for what just happened?
I think it’s clear that McP is saying the former is what will lead to the latter, but keep on being the contrarian just for the sake of it.
Answer my question
If they care about what’s happening to them, they should alert the proper authorities. You can’t do nothing about it and whine.
But if you know all you are doing is sending data into the bureaucracy that allowed lawlessness in the first place would you really feel like that would be a worthwhile use of your time?
It's sort of like how gerrymandering or bipartisanship or criminal justice/ police reform works, right?
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 4:59 pm
by Rob
Filing a police report is not a huge effort. I understand people are frustrated and maybe the system is broken (basically what the “Libs” argue everyday here, just for different reasons). But you are defending inaction. If the system is to be fixed, they will need the proper data to fix it correctly.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:01 pm
by verb_to_trust
Everyone keeps ignoring my original point. A business owner has better things to do than make some symbolic report so his grandkids can have a better life. Perhaps he would be more worried about trying to move his business out of a shithole that allows his window to get smashed every other week?
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:02 pm
by Rob
Perhaps you don’t like the answers and just want to keep on keepin on.
And not sure why the business owner couldn’t think about doing both.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:04 pm
by verb_to_trust
Because filing a police report is a huge effort
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:09 pm
by surfndestroy
Rob wrote:If they care about what’s happening to them, they should alert the proper authorities. You can’t do nothing about it and whine.
Do you adopt this attitude to sexual assault and intimate partner violence stats? People seem to acknowledge that the number of incidences is higher than reported. Just do the same with any crime statistic, especially in areas where they have gone soft on prosecution.
No one I know reports property crime here if they are not doing an insurance claim. No one does an insurance claim unless there was a very large loss because their insurance rates will go up. It’s just not worth the time when you know the perpetrator, even if caught will just be let to go on their merry way.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:09 pm
by elliseamos
verb_to_trust wrote:Because filing a police report is a huge effort
Huh, my city says the following:
Online reporting is easy, quick and convenient. The report can be submitted from any computer with internet access, including a kiosk in the police station's lobby. There is no need to wait for an available police officer, and police officers will be able to remain on patrol. A copy of your report will be emailed to you for free.
Re: Cops Are The Worst
Posted: Sun June 13, 2021 5:12 pm
by verb_to_trust
elliseamos wrote:
verb_to_trust wrote:Because filing a police report is a huge effort
Huh, my city says the following:
Online reporting is easy, quick and convenient. The report can be submitted from any computer with internet access, including a kiosk in the police station's lobby. There is no need to wait for an available police officer, and police officers will be able to remain on patrol. A copy of your report will be emailed to you for free.
Why don't they just come out and tell you they don't give a shit?