HBO: Game of Thrones (Song of Ice and Fire)

[E.H. Ruddock]

Tyrion

[stip]

I guess this is also one of those instances with Cersei where I just prefer the arc the book had for her. At no point in the novels is Cersei ever a sympathetic character. She leans that way at times in the show and it infuriates me. So combining those two things just gets to me. But like I said, this is really just a narrative preference for me.

And this is one of the tremendous strengths of the show in general and Lena especially.

I'll be honest and admit my complaints with Sansa are simply that I like the book better. There are some passages from her time in King's landing where she's set up to be more of an anti-Cersei, a Queen to be loved, not feared. And it makes me nervous in the show here she says stuff like "I learned so much from her".

You're far more familiar with the books than I am, so I'll concede the Sansa points but I don't remember getting that impression from the book.

There are passages in either ACOK or ASOS where there's talk of fear vs love. At one point Cersei makes the case for power coming from your subjects fearing you, and Sansa is just nodding her to death but in her inner monologue thinks something like "No, when I'm Queen I'll make them love me." Every time I've read it it just seems to be dripping with foreshadowing of Sansa as a powerful anti-Cersei queen.

Yeah, that's interesting. I never read it that way. At the time that read more sad to me, more like vanity and naïveté to me.

It's from Chapter XV of Machiavelli's Prince. He argues that it is better to be feared than loved, but it is important not to slide over into being hated.

[Norah]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

[E.H. Ruddock]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

lol

[Norah]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

lol

[epilogue]

I love Tyrion. But I don't like him as king.

[epilogue]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

Well that's completely insane. He's one of the most beloved characters in the books, Pete. Way before the show, when I started reading the series, everyone was talking about how great Tyrion is and how he's the best character in the series.

[Norah]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

Well that's completely insane. He's one of the most beloved characters in the books, Pete. Way before the show, when I started reading the series, everyone was talking about how great Tyrion is and how he's the best character in the series.

I get that. I think we're talking about different things. People can like him as a character, but he's much more of a villain in the books than the show and that's what I'm driving at. In the show you're all "oh maybe he'll be a good Hand to the Queen" and in the books you're all

Spoiler: show

"oh shit he's sending a competing invading army into Westeros and making deals with sellswords".

[epilogue]

I just... I don't...

[Norah]

I still love you.

[epilogue]

And I you, friend.

[stip]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

Well that's completely insane. He's one of the most beloved characters in the books, Pete. Way before the show, when I started reading the series, everyone was talking about how great Tyrion is and how he's the best character in the series.

I get that. I think we're talking about different things. People can like him as a character, but he's much more of a villain in the books than the show and that's what I'm driving at. In the show you're all "oh maybe he'll be a good Hand to the Queen" and in the books you're all

Spoiler: show

"oh shit he's sending a competing invading army into Westeros and making deals with sellswords".

I was pretty much rooting for him the whole time in the books, too. The deals with sellswords and the invasion of Westeros don't really read that differently in the books from what I remember.

[Anders]

Fuck Tyrion. The fact that people like and sympathize with him (I could say this about Cersei to an extent too) is a failure of the show.

Well that's completely insane. He's one of the most beloved characters in the books, Pete. Way before the show, when I started reading the series, everyone was talking about how great Tyrion is and how he's the best character in the series.

I get that. I think we're talking about different things. People can like him as a character, but he's much more of a villain in the books than the show and that's what I'm driving at. In the show you're all "oh maybe he'll be a good Hand to the Queen" and in the books you're all

Spoiler: show

"oh shit he's sending a competing invading army into Westeros and making deals with sellswords".

I was pretty much rooting for him the whole time in the books, too. The deals with sellswords and the invasion of Westeros don't really read that differently in the books from what I remember.

I read the books in 07-08, and I always rooted for Tyrion. Arya, Jon and him make the story.

Daenarys is a clear cut villain though. So will be interesting to see them meet in the books.

[BurtReynolds]

GRRM really shouldnt have cut off his nose. He was ugly enough.

[Anders]

GRRM really shouldnt have cut off his nose. He was ugly enough.

I never read him as actually ugly. It is more that others see him as ugly, a bit like Tyrion in the show.

[stip]

I was never really rooting for Danerys in the TV show, and not much in the books either. Tyrion's inclusion really upped her stock in my eyes

[BurtReynolds]

GRRM really shouldnt have cut off his nose. He was ugly enough.

I never read him as actually ugly. It is more that others see him as ugly, a bit like Tyrion in the show.

Well if people see you as ugly, you ugly.

[Anders]

GRRM really shouldnt have cut off his nose. He was ugly enough.

I never read him as actually ugly. It is more that others see him as ugly, a bit like Tyrion in the show.

Well if people see you as ugly, you ugly.

I just think on Westeros they would see all dwarfs as ugly, no matter how they looked or what they did. It's a highly prejudiced society. Tyrion only makes it so far because his family didn't kill him when he was born (which would be normal), and because he is of the very highest nobility. Of course even his closest family teases him and sets him up to be a fool, and partly hates him for his mother dying when giving birth to him. So he has a hard time in a lot of ways.

[dimejinky99]

Sorry if it's been answered but who's in the cell sam was at?

That sap that followed the dragon chick everywhere?

[Norah]

yeah that sap