Red Mosquito

Harry Lime wrote:If we went by what you thought, ellis, then every ball player is guilty. Even your favorite players.

ortiz and manny have both been exposed. i'm fairly certain nomar and pedro were users. trust me. i'm over it.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:who besides reserve DB's, 3rd down RBs, special teamers, and punters? LOL
has one starting QB been nabbed? ever?

looking only at steroids & HGH, comes up with these five non-reserves/special teamers:

2006: Shawne Merriman, OLB
2006: Hollis Thomas, DT
2007: Rodney Harrison, S
2010: Brian Cushing, OLB
2012: Joe Haden, CB

then there's the issue of adderall's abuse, and some have said it's being used to mask/excuse ped users. this espn story lists 50 suspensions across the NFL since 2010. just today von miller, possibly the top sack-man in the league, was suspended 4-games for a "drug violation" and has been reported to have tested positive for amphetamines in 2011 which is classified as a ped. you're wrong MTM, the nfl deals with this all the time.

elliseamos wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:who besides reserve DB's, 3rd down RBs, special teamers, and punters? LOL
has one starting QB been nabbed? ever?

looking only at steroids & HGH, comes up with these five non-reserves/special teamers:

2006: Shawne Merriman, OLB
2006: Hollis Thomas, DT
2007: Rodney Harrison, S
2010: Brian Cushing, OLB
2012: Joe Haden, CB

then there's the issue of adderall's abuse, and some have said it's being used to mask/excuse ped users. this espn story lists 50 suspensions across the NFL since 2010. just today von miller, possibly the top sack-man in the league, was suspended 4-games for a "drug violation" and has been reported to have tested positive for amphetamines in 2011 which is classified as a ped. you're wrong MTM, the nfl deals with this all the time.

nope, im not wrong... everyone remembers Balco for Barry Bonds... no one talks about the fact that SF 49ers were getting stuff from them too. Everyone talks about Bonds breaking records on roids, but no one remembers that a handful of Carolina Panthers Super Bowl team were linked to steroids... the media has constantly harped on Baseballs use / players, Braun getting away with it has been ESPN's top story for a year... you just mentioned 5 non reserves over a 8 year span... Baseball is dealing with multiple MVP winners. and as you just pointed out yourself, the use, is way worse in the NFL, yet their not catching as many people as Baseball, and ESPN, is not even covering that FACT

MadTIGERmaN wrote:nope, im not wrong... everyone remembers Balco for Barry Bonds... no one talks about the fact that SF 49ers were getting stuff from them too.

maybe it's b/c the 2002 49ers sucked and bonds was re-writing the mlb history books. i thought marginal players were off the table? I for one remember romanowski being involved, but that's also b/c romo was the most obvious juicer i've ever seen.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:Everyone talks about Bonds breaking records on roids, but no one remembers that a handful of Carolina Panthers Super Bowl team were linked to steroids...

see above.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:the media has constantly harped on Baseballs use / players, Braun getting away with it has been ESPN's top story for a year...

again, he won the mvp b/c of it... and carried his team to success they hadn't seen in a long time.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:you just mentioned 5 non reserves over a 8 year span... Baseball is dealing with multiple MVP winners.

That might say something more about MLB than it does the NFL.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:and as you just pointed out yourself, the use, is way worse in the NFL, yet their not catching as many people as Baseball, and ESPN, is not even covering that FACT

i never said use was worse in the nfl, i'm just saying it exists. i'd actually make the argument that mlb isn't catching nearly as many "big name players" as the nfl.

elliseamos wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:nope, im not wrong... everyone remembers Balco for Barry Bonds... no one talks about the fact that SF 49ers were getting stuff from them too.

maybe it's b/c the 2002 49ers sucked and bonds was re-writing the mlb history books. i thought marginal players were off the table? I for one remember romanowski being involved, but that's also b/c romo was the most obvious juicer i've ever seen.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:Everyone talks about Bonds breaking records on roids, but no one remembers that a handful of Carolina Panthers Super Bowl team were linked to steroids...

see above.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:the media has constantly harped on Baseballs use / players, Braun getting away with it has been ESPN's top story for a year...

again, he won the mvp b/c of it... and carried his team to success they hadn't seen in a long time.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:you just mentioned 5 non reserves over a 8 year span... Baseball is dealing with multiple MVP winners.

That might say something more about MLB than it does the NFL.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:and as you just pointed out yourself, the use, is way worse in the NFL, yet their not catching as many people as Baseball, and ESPN, is not even covering that FACT

i never said use was worse in the nfl, i'm just saying it exists. i'd actually make the argument that mlb isn't catching nearly as many "big name players" as the nfl.

how can you make the argument that MLB isnt catching nearly as many big name players, when Bonds, Palmero, McGuire, Sosa, Clemens, Braun and ARod? hello? the NFL's testing is a joke, they have players bigger, faster, stronger than ever and were supposed to believe its all because of great training? in the most physically demanding of sports. But yeah everyones doping in baseball...

Harry Lime wrote:Whatever. Fuck you guys. Braun proved his mvp caliber talent while clean in the 2012 season. And the Crew aren't going anywhere this season anyway. Looking forward to next year!

No. Fuck Ryan Braun. The lying piece of shit.

Theres a report coming out from "inside the locker room" that a lot of Brewers are PISSED and glad he got nailed, as they truely believed him... how they get this information / who talked is unknown... but like i said before, Lucroy, Tulo and Aaron Rogers voiced A LOT of support for Braun through all of this... and kept singing the "if you knew what i knew" song...

if thats true... might as well trade him now...

MadTIGERmaN wrote:Theres a report coming out from "inside the locker room" that a lot of Brewers are PISSED and glad he got nailed, as they truely believed him... how they get this information / who talked is unknown... but like i said before, Lucroy, Tulo and Aaron Rogers voiced A LOT of support for Braun through all of this... and kept singing the "if you knew what i knew" song...

if thats true... might as well trade him now...

Lucroy & Gallardo were just on Sportscenter. They sounded disappointed, but forgave him and welcome his return. If I wanted any support in the locker room, I'd want it from those two.

elliseamos wrote:

Harry Lime wrote:If we went by what you thought, ellis, then every ball player is guilty. Even your favorite players.

ortiz and manny have both been exposed. i'm fairly certain nomar and pedro were users. trust me. i'm over it.

The Sox, eh? Fever Pitch sucks.

If he's clean he'll never be MVP caliber again so yeah a trade for prospects would be good.

I wish the NFL had nailed Richard Sherman when they had the chance too...

verb_to_trust wrote:

Harry Lime wrote:Whatever. Fuck you guys. Braun proved his mvp caliber talent while clean in the 2012 season. And the Crew aren't going anywhere this season anyway. Looking forward to next year!

No. Fuck Ryan Braun. The lying piece of shit.

i find it amazing people like braun can lie the way they do.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

elliseamos wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:nope, im not wrong... everyone remembers Balco for Barry Bonds... no one talks about the fact that SF 49ers were getting stuff from them too.

maybe it's b/c the 2002 49ers sucked and bonds was re-writing the mlb history books. i thought marginal players were off the table? I for one remember romanowski being involved, but that's also b/c romo was the most obvious juicer i've ever seen.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:Everyone talks about Bonds breaking records on roids, but no one remembers that a handful of Carolina Panthers Super Bowl team were linked to steroids...

see above.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:the media has constantly harped on Baseballs use / players, Braun getting away with it has been ESPN's top story for a year...

again, he won the mvp b/c of it... and carried his team to success they hadn't seen in a long time.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:you just mentioned 5 non reserves over a 8 year span... Baseball is dealing with multiple MVP winners.

That might say something more about MLB than it does the NFL.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:and as you just pointed out yourself, the use, is way worse in the NFL, yet their not catching as many people as Baseball, and ESPN, is not even covering that FACT

i never said use was worse in the nfl, i'm just saying it exists. i'd actually make the argument that mlb isn't catching nearly as many "big name players" as the nfl.

how can you make the argument that MLB isnt catching nearly as many big name players, when Bonds, Palmero, McGuire, Sosa, Clemens, Braun and ARod? hello? the NFL's testing is a joke, they have players bigger, faster, stronger than ever and were supposed to believe its all because of great training? in the most physically demanding of sports. But yeah everyones doping in baseball...

Wait, I thought your argument was on the coverage of steroids between the 2 leagues, not the number?

braun is total scum

he let rodgers go to bat for him like a fool and lied straight to everyones face. i hope he gets banned for life and doesnt earn another penny

MadTIGERmaN wrote:how can you make the argument that MLB isnt catching nearly as many big name players, when Bonds, Palmero, McGuire, Sosa, Clemens, Braun and ARod?

seeing as the last two are the only ones (you've listed) that have occured in the five years, I'd say the NFL's PED suspensions are a little more frequent... what with 50 in the last 3 seasons.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:hello?

hi.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:the NFL's testing is a joke, they have players bigger, faster, stronger than ever and were supposed to believe its all because of great training?

who here is making the argument that the NFL isn't full of juicers?

MadTIGERmaN wrote:the most physically demanding of sports.

i'd say hockey is more demanding, but that's more based on the physical demands of the schedule rather than the player to player impact.

MadTIGERmaN wrote:But yeah everyones doping in baseball...

i agree.

for reference here's all the players in MLB suspended since 2010:

Edinson Volquez
Manny Ramirez (x2)
Eliézer Alfonzo
Guillermo Mota
Freddy Galvis
Marlon Byrd
Melky Cabrera
Bartolo Colon
Yasmani Grandal
Carlos Ruiz
Ryan Braun

and the players who were in the minors when they tested positive (again since 2010):

Prentice Redman (x2)
Pedro López
Omar Quintanilla
Matt Kinney
Kevin Frandsen
Daniel McCutchen

Its all of it, the way its being covered, the players being busted, all of it...
Baseball, went after a clinic to get 2 former MVP's and around 20 players total...

the NFL, which most everyone agrees has more people doping... makes less headlines catching lesser players. ESPN gives breaking news updates about anything baseball related with PED's... its just annoying...

MadTIGERmaN wrote:Its all of it, the way its being covered, the players being busted, all of it...
Baseball, went after a clinic to get 2 former MVP's and around 20 players total...

the NFL, which most everyone agrees has more people doping... makes less headlines catching lesser players. ESPN gives breaking news updates about anything baseball related with PED's... its just annoying...

would it be as annoying if it was someone else who got busted and shown to be a huge, huge liar?

warehouse wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:Its all of it, the way its being covered, the players being busted, all of it...
Baseball, went after a clinic to get 2 former MVP's and around 20 players total...

the NFL, which most everyone agrees has more people doping... makes less headlines catching lesser players. ESPN gives breaking news updates about anything baseball related with PED's... its just annoying...

would it be as annoying if it was someone else who got busted and shown to be a huge, huge liar?

yeah, ive been saying this for years, ever since Balco... everyone focused on Bonds (obviously because he was the HR champ) but it was barely even discussed that NFL guys were going there too... and I believe it was actually more NFL guys then MLB with Balco.

Its got nothing to with Braun, its got everything to do with me being an MLB fan

Maybe it's time for sports to realize they can't stop this stuff from happening no matter what they do.

4/5 wrote:Maybe it's time for sports to realize they can't stop this stuff from happening no matter what they do.

I go back and forth on this. The problem with this stance is that it will practically force everyone to use PEDs, and then you end up in the same place you would be if no one took them. That's why I think it's a joke to strip Lance Armstrong of his titles because of everyone else also taking them. If everyone was clean, I bet Lance probably still wins those titles.