Red Mosquito

theplatypus wrote:Ed very cleverly hid his real motivations behind recording Backspacer as a subliminal message in the chorus of "Gonna See My Friend".



"I need some money"

That is fantastic.

I actually enjoy this album. Never hated on it. Some excellent tracks on here.

theplatypus wrote:Ed very cleverly hid his real motivations behind recording Backspacer as a subliminal message in the chorus of "Gonna See My Friend".



"I need some money"

look, the important thing is that he had the integrity to admit it!

The new album reminds me how much I don't like Backspacer. I don't love the new album by any means but it's way better than Backspacer, minus GSMF.

Yeah, for me, Lightning Bolt really hurts Backspacer. It renders the album pointless and hollow.

Okay, I just had my first listen to backspacer since lightning bolt.

I still love this record, and i don't think L-bolt has made it disposable or inessential. Having said that, you can definitely see how closely related these two albums are--moreso than any other two records in the catalog, I think. And Lightning Bolt tends to do things better. Or, maybe more accurately, Lighting Bolt shows us how the songs could have been improved. Normally when we debate the pros and cons of songs it's all hypothetical. We're speculating. But given the similarities in the records now we kinda now what the songs might have happened with darker, or in some cases, more substantive lyrics (no Got Somes or Supersonics on Lightning Bolt). We know what the songs would have sounded like with a different sort of vocal performance, or what an extra 30 seconds of outro soloing might have sounded like.

But I don't know that this takes away from the record. If anything, it draws into starker relief the unencumbered immediacy of the record. The way in which it is a document of a moment of relief. Add the stuff Lightning Bolt did and Backspacer is no longer Backspacer. Which, for me at any rate, would be a bad thing.

Still a big fan of Speed of Sound-Force of Nature-The End.

Wish Got Some had some decent lyrics.

stip wrote:Having said that, you can definitely see how closely related these two albums are--moreso than any other two records in the catalog, I think.

Agreed. Honestly, to me the record put most differently into perspective by "Lightning Bolt" is "S/T," not "Backspacer." Prior to "LB," I always lumped "S/T" and "Backspacer" together as a certain type of "modern Pearl Jam" record, as a not necessarily particularly careful way of noting their following a string of records that all possessed certain artistic characteristics that I felt faded into the background after 2002 or 2003. "Backspacer" and "S/T" didn't really belong together, but they were always seen together, mentioned together, simply by virtue of chronology. With "Lightning Bolt," "Backspacer" divorces "S/T" and runs off with its soul mate, leaving "S/T" as a kind of loner in the catalog.

That said, I still prefer "Backspacer" to "Lightning Bolt" by a pretty wide margin. I think the best songs on "Lightning Bolt" reveal a flickering ember of the creative spirit I've missed seeing in this band since "Riot Act," but on the flipside there are more songs on "Lightning Bolt" that I just flat out don't care for than there have been on any Pearl Jam album yet, and I think the production approach that seemed generic and inappropriate on "Backspacer" continues into overdrive on "Lightning Bolt." While there are a lot of things I like about "Lightning Bolt," I don't think a single song on it has struck me in any kind of meaningful way yet, and that's not something I can say about either "S/T" or "Backspacer." It may be more me than the record, but it's the bottom of the catalog for me at this point. ("LB," that is.)

I think S/T really pairs with Riot Act. Not sonically. But just about everything on S/T is a direct response to Riot Act. Both in terms of its music, its themes, it's general approach. One record is really the inversion of the other.

Both could have been improved greatly by appreciating the strengths of the other

On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I really love the initial run of songs and Speed of Sound.

Dont care much for UK at this point or Supersonic...or The End.

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

I actually think his vocal ticks were less annoying on Backspacer. Well, maybe it's not actually ticks I'm talking about. It's his whole way of singing on this record. While I think he's singing with more force and strength on LB, it's the way he needs to sing to achieve that force that sometimes puts me off. Or maybe he just "found his voice" that's suitable for his age and I don't enjoy it that much. Some of his vocals sound a little forced to me. He's in full on modern-Ed mode here even though he is able to sound pretty close to his early voice when he sings older songs live (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk6XeSyBo8M I enjoy this for example) so I guess it's all intentional.
I think I sound more critical than I want to here. I still enjoy his singing a lot, just not as much as I'd like to.

I love him in SBM and Yellow Moon, though.

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

I actually think his vocal ticks were less annoying on Backspacer. Well, maybe it's not actually ticks I'm talking about. It's his whole way of singing on this record. While I think he's singing with more force and strength on LB, it's the way he needs to sing to achieve that force that sometimes puts me off. Or maybe he just "found his voice" that's suitable for his age and I don't enjoy it that much. Some of his vocals sound a little forced to me. He's in full on modern-Ed mode here even though he is able to sound pretty close to his early voice when he sings older songs live (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk6XeSyBo8M I enjoy this for example) so I guess it's all intentional.
I think I sound more critical than I want to here. I still enjoy his singing a lot, just not as much as I'd like to.

No, I entirely agree. But the Backspacer ticks I'm referring to are, like, the "aw-huh" in Just Breathe. Just as one example. I agree with you about the vocals in LB, but I don't think they'd be half the annoyance they are if they were turned down. I might be wrong, but there are things I can hear him doing which I shouldn't be hearing (like the way the word "instead" tapers off on "Infallible", and a hard click on the word "closer" on FD. There was another but I've forgotten where it is.

Mike wrote:I love him in SBM and Yellow Moon, though.

Me too.

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

I actually think his vocal ticks were less annoying on Backspacer. Well, maybe it's not actually ticks I'm talking about. It's his whole way of singing on this record. While I think he's singing with more force and strength on LB, it's the way he needs to sing to achieve that force that sometimes puts me off. Or maybe he just "found his voice" that's suitable for his age and I don't enjoy it that much. Some of his vocals sound a little forced to me. He's in full on modern-Ed mode here even though he is able to sound pretty close to his early voice when he sings older songs live (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk6XeSyBo8M I enjoy this for example) so I guess it's all intentional.
I think I sound more critical than I want to here. I still enjoy his singing a lot, just not as much as I'd like to.

No, I entirely agree. But the Backspacer ticks I'm referring to are, like, the "aw-huh" in Just Breathe. Just as one example. I agree with you about the vocals in LB, but I don't think they'd be half the annoyance they are if they were turned down. I might be wrong, but there are things I can hear him doing which I shouldn't be hearing (like the way the word "instead" tapers off on "Infallible", and a hard click on the word "closer" on FD. There was another but I've forgotten where it is.

Oh man, the "aw-huhs". Yeah, turning the vocals down a notch would have been nice. Sometimes it sounds like the "Eddie and Matt Cameron"-Show with some guest musicians. I think having the vocals not too loud sometimes even helps the vocals to be more powerful by being elevated by powerful music. Everything coming beautifully together as one. One of the reasons the Hail, Hail bridge is so powerful to me for example.

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

I actually think his vocal ticks were less annoying on Backspacer. Well, maybe it's not actually ticks I'm talking about. It's his whole way of singing on this record. While I think he's singing with more force and strength on LB, it's the way he needs to sing to achieve that force that sometimes puts me off. Or maybe he just "found his voice" that's suitable for his age and I don't enjoy it that much. Some of his vocals sound a little forced to me. He's in full on modern-Ed mode here even though he is able to sound pretty close to his early voice when he sings older songs live (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk6XeSyBo8M I enjoy this for example) so I guess it's all intentional.
I think I sound more critical than I want to here. I still enjoy his singing a lot, just not as much as I'd like to.

No, I entirely agree. But the Backspacer ticks I'm referring to are, like, the "aw-huh" in Just Breathe. Just as one example. I agree with you about the vocals in LB, but I don't think they'd be half the annoyance they are if they were turned down. I might be wrong, but there are things I can hear him doing which I shouldn't be hearing (like the way the word "instead" tapers off on "Infallible", and a hard click on the word "closer" on FD. There was another but I've forgotten where it is.

Oh man, the "aw-huhs". Yeah, turning the vocals down a notch would have been nice. Sometimes it sounds like the "Eddie and Matt Cameron"-Show with some guest musicians. I think having the vocals not too loud sometimes even helps the vocals to be more powerful by being elevated by powerful music. Everything coming beautifully together as one. One of the reasons the Hail, Hail bridge is so powerful to me for example.

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

I actually think his vocal ticks were less annoying on Backspacer. Well, maybe it's not actually ticks I'm talking about. It's his whole way of singing on this record. While I think he's singing with more force and strength on LB, it's the way he needs to sing to achieve that force that sometimes puts me off. Or maybe he just "found his voice" that's suitable for his age and I don't enjoy it that much. Some of his vocals sound a little forced to me. He's in full on modern-Ed mode here even though he is able to sound pretty close to his early voice when he sings older songs live (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk6XeSyBo8M I enjoy this for example) so I guess it's all intentional.
I think I sound more critical than I want to here. I still enjoy his singing a lot, just not as much as I'd like to.

No, I entirely agree. But the Backspacer ticks I'm referring to are, like, the "aw-huh" in Just Breathe. Just as one example. I agree with you about the vocals in LB, but I don't think they'd be half the annoyance they are if they were turned down. I might be wrong, but there are things I can hear him doing which I shouldn't be hearing (like the way the word "instead" tapers off on "Infallible", and a hard click on the word "closer" on FD. There was another but I've forgotten where it is.

Oh man, the "aw-huhs". Yeah, turning the vocals down a notch would have been nice. Sometimes it sounds like the "Eddie and Matt Cameron"-Show with some guest musicians. I think having the vocals not too loud sometimes even helps the vocals to be more powerful by being elevated by powerful music. Everything coming beautifully together as one. One of the reasons the Hail, Hail bridge is so powerful to me for example.

Didnt BOB actually play the percussion parts on the album?

Strat wrote:

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:

harmless wrote:

Mike wrote:On my way back home I was listening to Lightning Bolt but it somehow annoyed me (don't know why, might have been Ed) so I put Backspacer in instead. I enjoyed it a lot and don't buy the "Backspacer isn't necessary anymore now that we have LB." yet.

I think a lot of my issues with Ed's vocals on LB could be fixed by just turning him down in the mix. He's managed to sort out several of the vocal ticks that annoyed me on Backspacer, but the loudness of his vocal just brings more subtle vocal ticks to the forefront.

I think I'm changing my mind about Backspacer being unnecessary as well.

I actually think his vocal ticks were less annoying on Backspacer. Well, maybe it's not actually ticks I'm talking about. It's his whole way of singing on this record. While I think he's singing with more force and strength on LB, it's the way he needs to sing to achieve that force that sometimes puts me off. Or maybe he just "found his voice" that's suitable for his age and I don't enjoy it that much. Some of his vocals sound a little forced to me. He's in full on modern-Ed mode here even though he is able to sound pretty close to his early voice when he sings older songs live (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk6XeSyBo8M I enjoy this for example) so I guess it's all intentional.
I think I sound more critical than I want to here. I still enjoy his singing a lot, just not as much as I'd like to.

No, I entirely agree. But the Backspacer ticks I'm referring to are, like, the "aw-huh" in Just Breathe. Just as one example. I agree with you about the vocals in LB, but I don't think they'd be half the annoyance they are if they were turned down. I might be wrong, but there are things I can hear him doing which I shouldn't be hearing (like the way the word "instead" tapers off on "Infallible", and a hard click on the word "closer" on FD. There was another but I've forgotten where it is.

Oh man, the "aw-huhs". Yeah, turning the vocals down a notch would have been nice. Sometimes it sounds like the "Eddie and Matt Cameron"-Show with some guest musicians. I think having the vocals not too loud sometimes even helps the vocals to be more powerful by being elevated by powerful music. Everything coming beautifully together as one. One of the reasons the Hail, Hail bridge is so powerful to me for example.

Didnt BOB actually play the percussion parts on the album?

The liner notes say that Matt played drums and percussion, I think.