Red Mosquito

I remain steadfast in my opinion that Won't Tell into Upper Hand into Waiting for Stevie is the best 3-song run they've ever done. It's like the Half Dome hike of rock triptychs.

Chris_H_2 wrote:everything about this song up until the 3:35 mark bores the hell out of me

everything about this song after the 3:35 mark is amazing

The riff is fantastic throughout, but I mostly agree with this.

Monkey_Driven wrote:

Chris_H_2 wrote:everything about this song up until the 3:35 mark bores the hell out of me

everything about this song after the 3:35 mark is amazing

The riff is fantastic throughout, but I mostly agree with this.

I agree that there isn't a whole lot built onto that riff, but there really doesn't need to be, and the lyrics are great, and the bridge is chef's kiss.

McParadigm wrote:

Chris_H_2 wrote:everything about this song up until the 3:35 mark bores the hell out of me

everything about this song after the 3:35 mark is amazing

I’d love to disparage this comment, but it’s almost exactly how I’ve always felt about black

I think I understand both statements perfectly.

I love just about everything about this song so much, but what really strikes me about it, what makes it singular(ish?) in the catalog is how it takes what would be the moment of climax in a Ten era song (say the final chorus/outro of Alive, the bridge/outro of Breath, the last few minutes of Black) and finally asks the question, 'what if we just did this but for five minutes.' It's why both the verse and the chorus of WFS feel like the chorus, or that the song doesn't have one (I think the 'you can be loved' verses are the actual chorus, even though the lyrics keep changing and it sets up the verse, rather than resolves it).

Most songs build tension and they find the catharsis in the release. But WFS starts with release, and just asks you to keep letting go. There's that moment after the bridge where Eddie holds that note and the riff swells back in, where you think maybe you can take a breath, but you just jump right back into the release. There's this cool little moment, intentional or not, where Matt's playing stumbles for just a moment - its slightly uneven, like even the band itself is struggling to sustain this. And then it still manages to find a way to ramp up for the final minute or so. It's not unhinged or off the rails in the jammy way that something like Habit is, but it also doesn't feel composed either. It's almost like Mike looks at Matt and they just decide it's time to push out whatever they've been holding back. And the only thing that barely grounds it are the return of outro backing vocals, which were a Ten era mainstay (and so important).

Be Humble is a very cool piece in its own right, but it feels so much more impactful tagged onto the end of WFS because it finally gives you a moment to process. They usually build those moments into their anthematic songs, and just plowed straight through here.

There is in arguably a lot of repetition in WFS. There's not a ton of dynamic changes compared to say, Black. But even though it is repetitive, it is still unique. I think they're doing something genuinely different underneath what are (welcomingly) familiar trappings.

I heard it on the radio last night. I was actually surprised they kept the "Be Humble" piece in the radio version. I thought they might chop it off.

Probably because they are using the same album track and this one is not released as a single yet?

VinylGuy wrote:Probably because they are using the same album track and this one is not released as a single yet?

I think PJ sent something to radio stations this week because a bunch of rock stations added it to their playlists on Tuesday.

Fastest climbing track at active rock radio.

stip wrote:I love just about everything about this song so much, but what really strikes me about it, what makes it singular(ish?) in the catalog is how it takes what would be the moment of climax in a Ten era song (say the final chorus/outro of Alive, the bridge/outro of Breath, the last few minutes of Black) and finally asks the question, 'what if we just did this but for five minutes.' It's why both the verse and the chorus of WFS feel like the chorus, or that the song doesn't have one (I think the 'you can be loved' verses are the actual chorus, even though the lyrics keep changing and it sets up the verse, rather than resolves it).

Most songs build tension and they find the catharsis in the release. But WFS starts with release, and just asks you to keep letting go. There's that moment after the bridge where Eddie holds that note and the riff swells back in, where you think maybe you can take a breath, but you just jump right back into the release. There's this cool little moment, intentional or not, where Matt's playing stumbles for just a moment - its slightly uneven, like even the band itself is struggling to sustain this. And then it still manages to find a way to ramp up for the final minute or so. It's not unhinged or off the rails in the jammy way that something like Habit is, but it also doesn't feel composed either. It's almost like Mike looks at Matt and they just decide it's time to push out whatever they've been holding back. And the only thing that barely grounds it are the return of outro backing vocals, which were a Ten era mainstay (and so important).

Be Humble is a very cool piece in its own right, but it feels so much more impactful tagged onto the end of WFS because it finally gives you a moment to process. They usually build those moments into their anthematic songs, and just plowed straight through here.

There is in arguably a lot of repetition in WFS. There's not a ton of dynamic changes compared to say, Black. But even though it is repetitive, it is still unique. I think they're doing something genuinely different underneath what are (welcomingly) familiar trappings.

thiis is very cool and i agree yes. I mainly love the groove this one has.

this is not a soundgardeny groove (it feels more siamese dream to me) but there is a gigantic methodicalness to it, almost geological, that reminds me of soundgarden a bit

stip wrote:this is not a soundgardeny groove (it feels more siamese dream to me) but there is a gigantic methodicalness to it, almost geological, that reminds me of soundgarden a bit

Also, how close to zero smashing pumpkins records do you think anybody in this band regularly listens to

McParadigm wrote:

stip wrote:this is not a soundgardeny groove (it feels more siamese dream to me) but there is a gigantic methodicalness to it, almost geological, that reminds me of soundgarden a bit

Also, how close to zero smashing pumpkins records do you think anybody in this band regularly listens to

Maybe Matt likes some of Jimmy's drumming?

I heard a little bit of the most recent Smashing Pumpkins record the other day and it sounds a lot more like their old stuff. I'm not a big fan, but it perked up the ears of my son who likes their 90s output.

McParadigm wrote:

stip wrote:this is not a soundgardeny groove (it feels more siamese dream to me) but there is a gigantic methodicalness to it, almost geological, that reminds me of soundgarden a bit

Also, how close to zero smashing pumpkins records do you think anybody in this band regularly listens to

i bet Jeff is a huge fan of Machina II/The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music

RockPusher wrote:

McParadigm wrote:

stip wrote:this is not a soundgardeny groove (it feels more siamese dream to me) but there is a gigantic methodicalness to it, almost geological, that reminds me of soundgarden a bit

Also, how close to zero smashing pumpkins records do you think anybody in this band regularly listens to

Maybe Matt likes some of Jimmy's drumming?

I heard a little bit of the most recent Smashing Pumpkins record the other day and it sounds a lot more like their old stuff. I'm not a big fan, but it perked up the ears of my son who likes their 90s output.

it came up in my spotify. i tried the first somg. musically not bad but Corgan is now almost literally unlistenable

stip wrote:

RockPusher wrote:

McParadigm wrote:

stip wrote:this is not a soundgardeny groove (it feels more siamese dream to me) but there is a gigantic methodicalness to it, almost geological, that reminds me of soundgarden a bit

Also, how close to zero smashing pumpkins records do you think anybody in this band regularly listens to

Maybe Matt likes some of Jimmy's drumming?

I heard a little bit of the most recent Smashing Pumpkins record the other day and it sounds a lot more like their old stuff. I'm not a big fan, but it perked up the ears of my son who likes their 90s output.

it came up in my spotify. i tried the first somg. musically not bad but Corgan is now almost literally unlistenable

Definitely my least favorite voice from that era. I can tolerate Silversun Pickups, which are Corgan voice-adjacent lol, kind of like how Knopfler and Petty are Dylan voice-adjacent but so much better.

Goddamn this is great live. I enjoyed the outro/solo more than Alive or RITFW. They need to start closing with it.

Speaking of Corgan, they played in my area a few weeks ago and he did about a 30 min interview on our local sports talk radio station. They covered a lot of topics (music, etc), including his fandom of the Cubs. Without saying his name, he mentioned that he was pissed off that Ed got to sit next to Theo Epstein (Cubs General Manager) in a luxury suite during the Cubs' World Series run a few years back while he had to sit out in the bleachers. Kind've funny that he's petty about that.

wease wrote:Goddamn this is great live. I enjoyed the outro/solo more than Alive or RITFW. They need to start closing with it.

This song is why I made the trip Thursday, and I couldn’t agree more. It belongs in the encore. It could easily close, especially if they did the Be Humble part.

sweeper wrote:Speaking of Corgan, they played in my area a few weeks ago and he did about a 30 min interview on our local sports talk radio station. They covered a lot of topics (music, etc), including his fandom of the Cubs. Without saying his name, he mentioned that he was pissed off that Ed got to sit next to Theo Epstein (Cubs General Manager) in a luxury suite during the Cubs' World Series run a few years back while he had to sit out in the bleachers. Kind've funny that he's petty about that.

He sucks. I remember him saying Pearl Jam “doesn’t have the songs.” What an arse.