Red Mosquito

Tzu-Wei Lin

philpritchard wrote:Trout is about as close as anyone.

What if he ends his career today though? If he plays 5 more years, even average years, sure, but if he retires today? I don't know. Well, and he wouldn't be eligible (MLB requires 10 seasons)

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

philpritchard wrote:Trout is about as close as anyone.

What if he ends his career today though? If he plays 5 more years, even average years, sure, but if he retires today? I don't know. Well, and he wouldn't be eligible (MLB requires 10 seasons)

He's one of those "absolutely insane peak" guys I mentioned earlier. Aside from roided-out Bonds, he's easily the most dominant player any of us has ever watched.

philpritchard wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

philpritchard wrote:Trout is about as close as anyone.

What if he ends his career today though? If he plays 5 more years, even average years, sure, but if he retires today? I don't know. Well, and he wouldn't be eligible (MLB requires 10 seasons)

He's one of those "absolutely insane peak" guys I mentioned earlier. Aside from roided-out Bonds, he's easily the most dominant player any of us has ever watched.

Hey! Don't forget Miggy. His numbers are insane. 9 of 14 seasons in the top 10 for MVP voting, AND, he slowly cut the strike outs down over his career. If Trout can do that, look out.
from a pure hitting statistic standpoint? arguing Trout vs Miggy is almost like the Aaron vs Mays debate, cant go wrong with any of those 4
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play ... mi01.shtml

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

philpritchard wrote:

MadTIGERmaN wrote:

philpritchard wrote:Trout is about as close as anyone.

What if he ends his career today though? If he plays 5 more years, even average years, sure, but if he retires today? I don't know. Well, and he wouldn't be eligible (MLB requires 10 seasons)

He's one of those "absolutely insane peak" guys I mentioned earlier. Aside from roided-out Bonds, he's easily the most dominant player any of us has ever watched.

Hey! Don't forget Miggy. His numbers are insane. 9 of 14 seasons in the top 10 for MVP voting, AND, he slowly cut the strike outs down over his career. If Trout can do that, look out.
from a pure hitting statistic standpoint? arguing Trout vs Miggy is almost like the Aaron vs Mays debate, cant go wrong with any of those 4
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play ... mi01.shtml

Yep. Then you factor in that Trout has been an excellent defensive CF and one of the best baserunners in baseball instead of contributing no defensive value and horrible baserunning and Trout goes from historically great hitter (which Cabrera certainly was for a while) to the most dominant asterisk-free player any of us has ever seen.

Will T.O. make it in before Randy Moss, who is eligible this year?

Also, what are your thoughts on Ronde Barber? He is the only player in NFL history with over 40 interceptions and 20 sacks. I'm biased because I'm a Bucs fan, but he's got the career to get in, right?

E.H. Ruddock wrote:Will T.O. make it in before Randy Moss, who is eligible this year?

Also, what are your thoughts on Ronde Barber? He is the only player in NFL history with over 40 interceptions and 20 sacks. I'm biased because I'm a Bucs fan, but he's got the career to get in, right?

He certainly should be in contention. I get the feeling that John Lynch is the next Buc in line, though.

As for TO and Moss, I've always contended that they're Hall of Famers, but not first balloters due to their on-field/locker room issues that caused them to hop teams. I'll have to review that when we get the list of finalists or semifinalists to see if I still feel the same way about Moss.

Finally, if I may inject my own bias, I will be very pissed if the Contributors committee does not nominate Pat Bowlen next week. The longer he waits, the higher odds that he won't remember it due to Alzheimer's. He should have been nominated last year alongside Jerry Jones and going in the same time as TD, but the committee had to instead push a failed bid for Paul Tagliabue, ugh.

Green Habit wrote:

E.H. Ruddock wrote:Will T.O. make it in before Randy Moss, who is eligible this year?

Also, what are your thoughts on Ronde Barber? He is the only player in NFL history with over 40 interceptions and 20 sacks. I'm biased because I'm a Bucs fan, but he's got the career to get in, right?

He certainly should be in contention. I get the feeling that John Lynch is the next Buc in line, though.

As for TO and Moss, I've always contended that they're Hall of Famers, but not first balloters due to their on-field/locker room issues that caused them to hop teams. I'll have to review that when we get the list of finalists or semifinalists to see if I still feel the same way about Moss.

Finally, if I may inject my own bias, I will be very pissed if the Contributors committee does not nominate Pat Bowlen next week. The longer he waits, the higher odds that he won't remember it due to Alzheimer's. He should have been nominated last year alongside Jerry Jones and going in the same time as TD, but the committee had to instead push a failed bid for Paul Tagliabue, ugh.

Yeah, Lynch has been on the ballot for a couple of years already, though. And while his career was awesome, I'm not sure his numbers stack up to Barber's. For that reason I see Barber getting in first. I'll have to look at their numbers again, though.

TO should be in the hall of fame.

Randy should be first ballot hall of fame no question.

jwfocker wrote:TO should be in the hall of fame.

Randy should be first ballot hall of fame no question.

I whole heartily agree about Moss.

Ive been thinking and decided Beltre is an easy yes and I was wrong for ever thinking otherwise.

Monkey_Driven wrote:

jwfocker wrote:TO should be in the hall of fame.

Randy should be first ballot hall of fame no question.

I whole heartily agree about Moss.

Statistically, Moss is the second best wide receiver ever. He's a first ballot guy for sure.

TO will get in this time.

I really hope Urlacher doesn't get in on first ballot.

One of the most overrated players in NFL history.

~1,300 total tackles, just 41.5 sacks and only created 34 turnovers

I'm not saying he was bad, he was pretty good. But people talk about him like he was a fucking god.

E.H. Ruddock wrote:

Green Habit wrote:

E.H. Ruddock wrote:Will T.O. make it in before Randy Moss, who is eligible this year?

Also, what are your thoughts on Ronde Barber? He is the only player in NFL history with over 40 interceptions and 20 sacks. I'm biased because I'm a Bucs fan, but he's got the career to get in, right?

He certainly should be in contention. I get the feeling that John Lynch is the next Buc in line, though.

As for TO and Moss, I've always contended that they're Hall of Famers, but not first balloters due to their on-field/locker room issues that caused them to hop teams. I'll have to review that when we get the list of finalists or semifinalists to see if I still feel the same way about Moss.

Finally, if I may inject my own bias, I will be very pissed if the Contributors committee does not nominate Pat Bowlen next week. The longer he waits, the higher odds that he won't remember it due to Alzheimer's. He should have been nominated last year alongside Jerry Jones and going in the same time as TD, but the committee had to instead push a failed bid for Paul Tagliabue, ugh.

Yeah, Lynch has been on the ballot for a couple of years already, though. And while his career was awesome, I'm not sure his numbers stack up to Barber's. For that reason I see Barber getting in first. I'll have to look at their numbers again, though.

Lynch, Polamalu, and Ed Reed have 41 combined forced fumbles. Brian Dawkins had 36 himself. 37 Ints, 26 Sacks, just missed Barbers club.
I hate though that the NFL most likely will not put Dawkins in, until the other DBs / safeties that retired before him are in. Not even saying Dawkins should get in before them, its just the way the NFL HoF seems to work (especially with WR's)

@SkitchP wrote:Ive been thinking and decided Beltre is an easy yes and I was wrong for ever thinking otherwise.

I'm glad you've come around.

run2death wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

jwfocker wrote:TO should be in the hall of fame.

Randy should be first ballot hall of fame no question.

I whole heartily agree about Moss.

Statistically, Moss is the second best wide receiver ever. He's a first ballot guy for sure.

TO will get in this time.

I really hope Urlacher doesn't get in on first ballot.

One of the most overrated players in NFL history.

~1,300 total tackles, just 41.5 sacks and only created 34 turnovers

I'm not saying he was bad, he was pretty good. But people talk about him like he was a fucking god.

Urlacher is one of the most over-rated players of the last 25-30 years

chud and I talked a bit about Dustin Pedroia's shot a little earlier this season (in the MLB thread). I've got this sinking feeling that his current knee injury may fall somewhere on the spectrum of "career shortener" to "career ender" (and, at the very least, slow him down for the rest of his playing days). If his career tails off from now on, I don't think he's got a shot.

no way he's got a shot if this is the beginning of his end

There's a small glimmer of hope from the "played hard, played the right way" camp, but not enough to push him across the finish line. I dunno what the injury is exactly, but I hope that if he needs surgery or something, he does it right away as opposed to trying rehab and trying to get back this year.

Simple Torture wrote:There's a small glimmer of hope from the "played hard, played the right way" camp, but not enough to push him across the finish line. I dunno what the injury is exactly, but I hope that if he needs surgery or something, he does it right away as opposed to trying rehab and trying to get back this year.

I am no Boston fan, but when I think of baseball over the past 10 years, he's one of the first 5 names that springs to mind. He doesn't have the magic numbers for the HOF, and I'm annoyed by that obsession with numbers. I don't understand how someone can be the best rookie, be the most valuable player, be the best fielder at his position 4 times, and play a key role in capturing the ultimate prize twice, all while maintaining a career average over .300 and not get in.

He's been hurt too much.