Red Mosquito

tree_ wrote:I can't let them go, no matter how horrible Ed has ended up sounding. I'm actually impressed with a lot of the music they are making. I think they should replace Ed to save themselves from further embarrassment. I respect and am interested in differing opinions. I struggle, but try to understand how people can still enjoy Ed's vocal performances.

I think the thing that gets under the skin of people who, for instance, can't imagine this band with any other singer, is that you are stating your opinion as if it's fact. To me, Ed doesn't sound horrible. There is no "embarrasment"- not even when you isolate the vocals- hell, especially when you isolate the vocals. That "struggle" sounds disingenuous, considering that each of us has always been and will always be entitled to our own opinions. I don't struggle to understand how my good friend likes Creed. I hate Creed, but that's just her jam. Whatever. We also both love Pearl Jam, which is wonderful for us together.

oneway23 wrote:

E.H. Ruddock wrote:So this far in to a band's career, and no one can be critical of any of it? You like every single song? So this thread should just be a jizz fest about the song? That seems more like the Pit. I like this song, but I also like hearing why others may not like it. I did like it in 06, but didn't in 13, but do in 24. But I'm not going to like ALL of the songs, does that make me a bad fan? Sorry, but saying one is wasting keyboard miles or brain space just because it may not be their "In My Tree" (awful song btw), is a bad take.

Must you love every song? Certainly not. Is that really what you gleaned from my post?

All opinions welcome, all insights appreciated...Fantastic.
Post after post of the same? Not so much...

yeah

literally nobody is doing what you're saying they're doing, Ruddock; we all hoped that we wouldn't be disappointed, and most of us are unpacking why we aren't disappointed; if that sounds like cult mentality to you, you need to go out and "touch grass", as the kiddos say now

fuckin hell, someone make a separate thread to discuss the production values specifically. i can't take it anymore.

tree_ wrote:I think they should replace Ed to save themselves from further embarrassment. I respect and am interested in differing opinions. I struggle, but try to understand how people can still enjoy Ed's vocal performances.

This is a condescending and toxic statement.

tree_ wrote:i cannot listen to 10 seconds without giggling aloud.. but that is easily the funniest part

This is definitely not "respect and am interested in differing opinions." This is, "I'm so above this and Ed sounds so awful, how can you idiots like this?"

Ms Harmless wrote:

oneway23 wrote:

E.H. Ruddock wrote:So this far in to a band's career, and no one can be critical of any of it? You like every single song? So this thread should just be a jizz fest about the song? That seems more like the Pit. I like this song, but I also like hearing why others may not like it. I did like it in 06, but didn't in 13, but do in 24. But I'm not going to like ALL of the songs, does that make me a bad fan? Sorry, but saying one is wasting keyboard miles or brain space just because it may not be their "In My Tree" (awful song btw), is a bad take.

Must you love every song? Certainly not. Is that really what you gleaned from my post?

All opinions welcome, all insights appreciated...Fantastic.
Post after post of the same? Not so much...

yeah

literally nobody is doing what you're saying they're doing, Ruddock; we all hoped that we wouldn't be disappointed, and most of us are unpacking why we aren't disappointed; if that sounds like cult mentality to you, you need to go out and "touch grass", as the kiddos say now

I'm not the one that said cult mentality! It was tree! or someone! I'm just defending people wanting to come here and say they don't like the song. Which I love by the way! Jeez. Tough crowd.

spike wrote:fuckin hell, someone make a separate thread to discuss the production values specifically. i can't take it anymore.

Good lord. I do not need more threads.

I think I love it more after reading Stip's write up

Leatherhead wrote:

tree_ wrote:I think they should replace Ed to save themselves from further embarrassment. I respect and am interested in differing opinions. I struggle, but try to understand how people can still enjoy Ed's vocal performances.

This is a condescending and toxic statement.

tree_ wrote:i cannot listen to 10 seconds without giggling aloud.. but that is easily the funniest part

This is definitely not "respect and am interested in differing opinions." This is, "I'm so above this and Ed sounds so awful, how can you idiots like this?"

yes thank you

tragabigzanda wrote:

Kevin Davis wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote: If it fails, it fails because of Andrew Wottman, Serban Ghanea, and presumably Ed because he decided who gets to produce and mix.

I cranked it in my car a few times this morning, and the good parts (the band dynamics and Ed’s passion) sounded better, while the bad parts (the mix) sounded worse.

It’s difficult for me to view their choice of Ghanea as being anything other than 100% commercially oriented: Let’s get the guy who makes songs sound louder than everything else on the radio, in hopes we can sell a few more $175 tickets.

Genuine question: Is the Watt/Ghanea approach unique? I feel like this over-boosted, mega-compressed mastering style is characteristic of many modern, major-artist recordings. It's awful, but...do Watt/Ghanea push it to a new level of awful? My ears aren't sharp enough to pick up that level of difference.

I can't imagine PJ are depending on radio exposure to sell concert tickets. I'm guessing they just don't have very good instincts for this stuff.

I think what's unique is that they're applying a common formula to a band that built its career on their collective personality as an incredibly powerful live band. This approach almost completely undermines that, IMO.

This doesn't make sense considering your follow up post about the performance

RockPusher wrote:

tree_ wrote:I can't let them go, no matter how horrible Ed has ended up sounding. I'm actually impressed with a lot of the music they are making. I think they should replace Ed to save themselves from further embarrassment. I respect and am interested in differing opinions. I struggle, but try to understand how people can still enjoy Ed's vocal performances.

I think the thing that gets under the skin of people who, for instance, can't imagine this band with any other singer, is that you are stating your opinion as if it's fact. To me, Ed doesn't sound horrible. There is no "embarrasment"- not even when you isolate the vocals- hell, especially when you isolate the vocals. That "struggle" sounds disingenuous, considering that each of us has always been and will always be entitled to our own opinions. I don't struggle to understand how my good friend likes Creed. I hate Creed, but that's just her jam. Whatever. We also both love Pearl Jam, which is wonderful for us together.

those amateur "isolated vocals" things AWAYS sound silly, and always made Ed sound silly, for one thing because they still retain a trace of the music behind them, and whatever AI filters are supposed to be silencing it; we're not hearing Ed's pure vocal here

Strat wrote:I think I love it more after reading Stip's write up

Ms Harmless wrote:

RockPusher wrote:

tree_ wrote:I can't let them go, no matter how horrible Ed has ended up sounding. I'm actually impressed with a lot of the music they are making. I think they should replace Ed to save themselves from further embarrassment. I respect and am interested in differing opinions. I struggle, but try to understand how people can still enjoy Ed's vocal performances.

I think the thing that gets under the skin of people who, for instance, can't imagine this band with any other singer, is that you are stating your opinion as if it's fact. To me, Ed doesn't sound horrible. There is no "embarrasment"- not even when you isolate the vocals- hell, especially when you isolate the vocals. That "struggle" sounds disingenuous, considering that each of us has always been and will always be entitled to our own opinions. I don't struggle to understand how my good friend likes Creed. I hate Creed, but that's just her jam. Whatever. We also both love Pearl Jam, which is wonderful for us together.

those amateur "isolated vocals" things AWAYS sound silly, and always made Ed sound silly, for one thing because they still retain a trace of the music behind them, and whatever AI filters are supposed to be silencing it; we're not hearing Ed's pure vocal here

They eliminate certain frequencies, too, that play into things like vocal clarity and diction

I don't know when I started doing this (probably mid 2000s when I started getting invested in the SOTM series) but at some point I really started listening to all Pearl Jam in the context of the entire catalog - rarely as a stand alone song in its own right. I think that's really helped me contextualize each song as a moment measured against a much larger series of songs, appreciate them for what they're trying to do without having them have to bear the weight of my entire fandom. It's probably helped open up some things I would have otherwise dismissed. Not that there aren't still songs I skip or don't care for.

I just wonder if people actually like Ed's voice as it is now, or if it's at least mostly because of their history loving the band, their investments and memories that have clouded their judgment. I wonder how many of you who claim to love Ed's voice in this new song, if it were the first time you were hearing this singer's voice, if you'd feel the same about it. I also wonder if I'm missing something. Maybe there is something in my brain that reacts to a frequency other people aren't hearing or something.

Jorge wrote:

Ms Harmless wrote:

RockPusher wrote:

tree_ wrote:I can't let them go, no matter how horrible Ed has ended up sounding. I'm actually impressed with a lot of the music they are making. I think they should replace Ed to save themselves from further embarrassment. I respect and am interested in differing opinions. I struggle, but try to understand how people can still enjoy Ed's vocal performances.

I think the thing that gets under the skin of people who, for instance, can't imagine this band with any other singer, is that you are stating your opinion as if it's fact. To me, Ed doesn't sound horrible. There is no "embarrasment"- not even when you isolate the vocals- hell, especially when you isolate the vocals. That "struggle" sounds disingenuous, considering that each of us has always been and will always be entitled to our own opinions. I don't struggle to understand how my good friend likes Creed. I hate Creed, but that's just her jam. Whatever. We also both love Pearl Jam, which is wonderful for us together.

those amateur "isolated vocals" things AWAYS sound silly, and always made Ed sound silly, for one thing because they still retain a trace of the music behind them, and whatever AI filters are supposed to be silencing it; we're not hearing Ed's pure vocal here

They eliminate certain frequencies, too, that play into things like vocal clarity and diction

I just think they're neat

Guys, you're all fine. I think we're all just trying to tell tree to shut the fuck up. Which is what ends up happening in most threads he posts in across the board.

tragabigzanda wrote:

Jorge wrote:Nobody else thinks this would fit right in with Lightning Bolt? Sounds so slick and plasticky

The production is somehow worse than LB, but the band interplay is markedly better. Go figure.

There's no way I can get behind this. I understand it's a bit plasticky sounding, but I just tried about 20 seconds of Getaway and it sounded like mush.