Red Mosquito

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

B wrote:

knee tunes wrote:wease, strat, and mickey are just trolls in this thread. Why dont you guys just stay out?

The whole reason this thread exists is to keep from having to ban tree_ for being a troll. If he's going to make racist arguments with paltry data, he can expect to have his view ridiculed.

If any one thing, I'm observing differences in socioeconomic groups. I'm not saying black people are born to commit crime. I'm saying poverty is detrimental, no matter your race. It so happens that, for many reasons, including the legacy of racism in America, black people disproportionately suffer from poverty, which creates more crime. And I'm saying this is the problem that needs to be addressed. This is what people should be protesting because it's tragic. Police are not the big problem people are making them out to be. And it's more harmful for the black community, and for all poor communities, to turn against the police.

knee tunes wrote:wease, strat, and mickey are just trolls in this thread. Why dont you guys just stay out?

That's rich. tree_'s total modus operandi is to troll, yet the ones that call him out on it are the trolls.

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

We've been trying to explain this to him ad nauseam but he just won't have it.

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

Dude, I also have no idea what's going on in here anymore.

wease wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

We've been trying to explain this to him ad nauseam but he just won't have it.

Yeah, I don't think I'm going to convince anyone. When was the last time someone changed their mind on the internet?

Bi_3 wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

Dude, I also have no idea what's going on in here anymore.

The sentence right after that is the only point I was trying to make; I feel like it's pretty straightforward.

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

digster wrote:

wease wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

We've been trying to explain this to him ad nauseam but he just won't have it.

Yeah, I don't think I'm going to convince anyone. When was the last time someone changed their mind on the internet?

Well, you have to be open to change, first.

Answer this question: who has a higher likelihood to be successful in life? A person born into a a poor household, with one parent struggling to survive, or into a wealthy household with very successful parents with master's degrees?

tree_ wrote:If any one thing, I'm observing differences in socioeconomic groups. I'm not saying black people are born to commit crime. I'm saying poverty is detrimental, no matter your race. It so happens that, for many reasons, including the legacy of racism in America, black people disproportionately suffer from poverty, which creates more crime. And I'm saying this is the problem that needs to be addressed. This is what people should be protesting because it's tragic. Police are not the big problem people are making them out to be. And it's more harmful for the black community, and for all poor communities, to turn against the police.

I don't think most people in this thread think it's all about the police or think the protesting is or should be only about the police. I'm focused on the "it so happens that, for many reasons" part of what you said and trying to explore the underlying reasons and grievances and steps that can be taken. My belief is that a lot of the "many reasons" have to do with systemic barriers, both explicit and implicit, that have led to where we are today. The protests, while prompted specifically by images of police brutality, are about these systemic issues.

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:If any one thing, I'm observing differences in socioeconomic groups. I'm not saying black people are born to commit crime. I'm saying poverty is detrimental, no matter your race. It so happens that, for many reasons, including the legacy of racism in America, black people disproportionately suffer from poverty, which creates more crime. And I'm saying this is the problem that needs to be addressed. This is what people should be protesting because it's tragic. Police are not the big problem people are making them out to be. And it's more harmful for the black community, and for all poor communities, to turn against the police.

I don't think most people in this thread think it's all about the police or think the protesting is or should be only about the police. I'm focused on the "it so happens that, for many reasons" part of what you said and trying to explore the underlying reasons and grievances and steps that can be taken. My belief is that a lot of the "many reasons" have to do with systemic barriers, both explicit and implicit, that have led to where we are today. The protests, while prompted specifically by images of police brutality, are about these systemic issues.

Its almost as if though tree isn't actually listening to the conversation!

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

Bingo.

And also more likely to be arrested for committing the same type of crime that affluent white people commit.

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

Yes. It should be about poor people. The racism narrative has gotten out of control.

Strat wrote:

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

Bingo.

And also more likely to be arrested for committing the same type of crime that affluent white people commit.

Agreed. And affluent black people.

This thread grows at a terrifying rate, like some kind of monstrous fungus.

tree_ wrote:

Strat wrote:

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

Bingo.

And also more likely to be arrested for committing the same type of crime that affluent white people commit.

Agreed.

and that , my friend, is systemic racism. So do you understand now?

Strat wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Strat wrote:

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

Bingo.

And also more likely to be arrested for committing the same type of crime that affluent white people commit.

Agreed.

and that , my friend, is systemic racism. So do you understand now?

No. Because an affluent black person also has the upper hand over a poor white person.

tree_ wrote:

Strat wrote:

tree_ wrote:

Strat wrote:

4/5 wrote:

tree_ wrote:

digster wrote:

wease wrote:Give up, digster.

I'm done, and granted, the quote threads probably make the last few pages look like a mess; just wanted to make the point that thinking that black people are more likely to commit crimes, whatever the reason you may have for thinking that, is by definition bias and is going to show up in the work of police officers if they share that view.

I don't think black people are more likely to commit crimes, I think poor people are more likely to commit crimes. If a black person and a white person were born into the same socioeconomic situation, I have no reason to believe one would be less successful than the other.

I think poor people are more likely to be arrested for committing the type of crimes we choose to police the most.

Bingo.

And also more likely to be arrested for committing the same type of crime that affluent white people commit.

Agreed.

and that , my friend, is systemic racism. So do you understand now?

No. Because an affluent black person also has the upper hand over a poor white person.

Wrong.