Red Mosquito

He totally punched that girl in Forrest Gump, too.

Well, somebody needed to.

The thing I love about the Beatles is the dichotomy that they're both the best band ever and overrated. Of course they're overrated, having such superlatives attached to them. I think stip's off on his thinking here a bit. For a lot of people who listen more than passively to what's on the radio the Beatles have to overcome being overrated and revered without peer. This drives a lot of people away, so for a fraction of listeners the music really has to earn it.

Anecdotal evidence: I fucking hated the Beatles because of this when I was young (early to mid-high school) and the poppy love love love stuff. When I actually started listening, I gave them their due and realized that I think they're the best. And they're not my favorite, but I do really think they are the best.

Gods' Die wrote:The thing I love about the Beatles is the dichotomy that they're both the best band ever and overrated.

Is it possible to rate a band more than that?

Gods' Die wrote:Anecdotal evidence: I fucking hated the Beatles because of this when I was young (early to mid-high school) and the poppy love love love stuff. When I actually started listening, I gave them their due and realized that I think they're the best. And they're not my favorite, but I do really think they are the best.

I'm kind of the opposite. When I first got to the point where music became the most important thing in the world to me, The Beatles were the first band I went "back" to get into, because all I ever heard about was that they were the greatest band ever. And at first I was really into them, and took the time to get to know the entire catalog. But then I started checking out other things from the past and expanding my tastes beyond the mainstream/alternative U2/Pearl Jam type stuff, and they fell off pretty fast and hard for me. The deeper I delved into the past, the less and less interest I had in them until it got to the point that I realized I didn't even care enough to call them a band I "liked." In the years since then, the gulf between their material I still enjoy and their material that I'm fairly indifferent to seems to just get bigger and bigger. As I've said a few times before, I would never deny their influence or popularity, and I suppose I can see why other people would think they're the best, but for me they're not even in the discussion. I guess they're a lot like Bob Dylan in that sense for me.

harmless wrote:

Gods' Die wrote:The thing I love about the Beatles is the dichotomy that they're both the best band ever and overrated.

Is it possible to rate a band more than that?

I believe there was talk of wheels, spokes, houses, and guests.

They're just a band, so when they're talked of as the end all be all, yeah, how can that not be an overrating? And to make the dichotomy interesting they're also the best ever.

But I assume you were just being an ass, and your question was rhetorical.

Gods' Die wrote:

harmless wrote:

Gods' Die wrote:The thing I love about the Beatles is the dichotomy that they're both the best band ever and overrated.

Is it possible to rate a band more than that?

I believe there was talk of wheels, spokes, houses, and guests.

They're just a band, so when they're talked of as the end all be all, yeah, how can that not be an overrating? And to make the dichotomy interesting they're also the best ever.

But I assume you were just being an ass, and your question was rhetorical.

Well, no, I'm genuinely wondering how a band can be both overrated and the best band ever.

McParadigm wrote:Pete Best? Pete gets mentioned all the time.

I'm sure they were referring to Johnny Hutchinson, who was only actually grabbed as a stand-in for the "Silver Beetles" when the band fired one drummer, learned that they had to wait two days for the new guy to start, and had two gigs in the meantime. He was never actually asked or recruited for the band....he did play the stand-in gigs, but he was vocal about not liking the band at that time.

He came around to liking them, and later volunteered to stand in yet again when they had a few drummerless gigs before Ringo could join them.

It wasn't Pete Best, so I gather it was Johnny Hutchinson. The way the guide told the story it was along the lines of this local Liverpool drummer knocking back a spot in the band. Anyways it was interesting. This old bloke seemed legit but it was 10 years ago so I may have forgotten some of the details.

Strawberry Fields had a bit of a creepy vibe too. I should dig out the photos.

I realize I'm 36 pages late but don't really like them either. I can appreciate what they've done and meant for music, and I'm not offended or cringing whenever I hear them or anything. I like a few of their tunes but I would never purposely play any of their songs.

Lament wrote: In the years since then, the gulf between their material I still enjoy and their material that I'm fairly indifferent to seems to just get bigger and bigger.

Yeah...I'm the same way in this regard. There's a lot of songs on those records that I never revisit while skipping around them to hear the ones I adore. I guess that's not a gulf getting bigger as much as I just don't have the time for them anymore. And as music is easier and easier to attain I spend less time trying to get myself to like things I think I'm supposed to like, but with these guys there wasn't any of that homework feeling...it almost immediately became incredibly exciting to see what I could discover next. "How fucking good can these guys possibly be?" And they also fill the role of intellectually liking someone where it pays off the more you listen to them to go with the instant gratification.

harmless wrote:

Gods' Die wrote:

harmless wrote:

Gods' Die wrote:The thing I love about the Beatles is the dichotomy that they're both the best band ever and overrated.

Is it possible to rate a band more than that?

I believe there was talk of wheels, spokes, houses, and guests.

They're just a band, so when they're talked of as the end all be all, yeah, how can that not be an overrating? And to make the dichotomy interesting they're also the best ever.

But I assume you were just being an ass, and your question was rhetorical.

Well, no, I'm genuinely wondering how a band can be both overrated and the best band ever.

Because at the end of the day they're another band with producers, studios, instruments, and singers. The level they're generally assumed to be on doesn't seem like something that's actually attainable to me. They were the best, but there's so many flaws and talented challengers with amazing catalogs. I guess what I'm saying is they're not Jesus, the gaps between them and the other top tier artists of all time is small.

Gods' Die wrote:The thing I love about the Beatles is the dichotomy that they're both the best band ever and overrated. Of course they're overrated, having such superlatives attached to them. I think stip's off on his thinking here a bit. For a lot of people who listen more than passively to what's on the radio the Beatles have to overcome being overrated and revered without peer. This drives a lot of people away, so for a fraction of listeners the music really has to earn it.

I agree with this, I'm 40 years old and until about a year and a half ago I never owned a Beatles album. Growing up I couldn't help but hear the Beatles everywhere and I always thought yeah whatever. I randomly heard Tomorrow Never Know someplace and really liked it and so I bought Revolver, and then Rubber Soul, and then Abbey Road and just kept buying them. I can’t believe I lived almost 40 years without ever hearing the entire Abbey Road medley, or songs like Yer Blues, And Your Bird Can Sing, I’m Looking through You, I’ve Just Seen a Face, etc, etc.

kreng wrote:I realize I'm 36 pages late but don't really like them either. I can appreciate what they've done and meant for music, and I'm not offended or cringing whenever I hear them or anything. I like a few of their tunes but I would never purposely play any of their songs.

This is exactly what I would have been saying a couple of years ago.

harmless wrote:I'm genuinely wondering how a band can be both overrated and the best band ever.

I think it's perfectly valid for someone to say that the Beatles are overrated simply because a high percentage of people if put on the spot to name the best band ever would name them as a default even if they didn't really believe it. It's the easy obvious answer. Like saying Bruce Lee is the greatest martial artist or Mario Bros is the best video game ever. Stip is right pop culture has a heavy lean towards certain properties. I also think that if you were having a discussion of the best bands ever and someone choose the Beatles (or Mario or Bruce in their respective fields ) they would be on pretty solid ground. They belong in the conversation. A serious contender. I mean if I ranked the Beatles as a 99.9 out of 100 and had 50 other artists at 99.8 does it really matter if I think the Beatles .1% better? It's fun to argue but it's such a close call.

Ray Davies' 1966 review of Revolver.

“Yellow Submarine” - “This is a load of rubbish, really. I take the mickey out of myself on the piano and play stuff like this. I think they know it’s not that good.”

http://dangerousminds.net/comments/the_ ... as_garbage

Waterloo Sunset is better than any Beatles song.

Though to be fair, Waterloo Sunset is better than almost any song by anyone, ever.

That's not even the best Kinks song.

It's one of the most perfectly crafted melancholy pop songs ever. Not that there aren't lots of other great Kinks songs, but nothing will ever match Waterloo Sunset for me. The way he sings "But I don't need no friends" kills me every single time in a way very few other moments in pop history kill me.

I don't like Waterloo Sunset very much.

It's okay, I guess.

It's definitely super okay.

Man, the way the backing vocals ascend during the pre-chorus before the super chugging 60's guitar riff comes back in...goosebumps.

I'm a perennially sad bastard though, so I'm sure that has a lot to do with my undying love of Waterloo Sunset.