Red Mosquito

digster wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Birds in Hell wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Birds in Hell wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:True but there is also the marketing/optics of the thing.

durdencommatyler wrote:But I'm just saying S-K is an entity/brand/business and one could argue that this looks really bad for everyone else involved.

I don't think these should be important considerations.

In fact, I suspect it's actively harmful to a band's creative energy to conceptualise what they're doing in these terms.

Of course you do, you're a fan. I would tend to agree with you as a music fan. But that's just not the way the world works. And whether or not you and I want to think about that stuff, I'm sure there are people within the SK machine whose job is absolutely think about this stuff. It's just one more consideration/perspective that I think has to be thought about in the grand scheme of this whole thing if anyone is to look at it all honestly.

Maybe we're looking at this through a different lens but I don't agree that the world necessarily works that way, it's a deliberate choice - and to S-K's credit, they haven't seemed to take a "protect the brand" approach here either.

I'm not sure what other options would've been available to Janet in this circumstance that would've resulted in less "damage to the brand": does she stick it out in the band even though she hates the new music? Does she still leave but provide some bland, smokescreen reason? I don't see how either of those is preferable on a personal or professional level.

Again, I agree with you. My point was never that those voices were "right" or "valid." Just that I'm sure they exist and from that point of view (not the only point of view, not the correct point of view, necessarily) it's really fucking bad timing. I wouldn't be surprised if these discussions were happening, is all I'm saying. Even WITHOUT Carrie and Corinne.

It's just one other angle to consider, not the answer. And if one subscribes to that POV or takes time to consider it, there's an argument that the move is super shitty on that scale.

Again, not saying I agree with that. Just looking at various possible angles.

I think it also could be less about branding and more just a feeling of this decision defining a piece of art you've made, and something that may be very important to you. If on top of feeling like they've been left in the lurch on the tour, Carrie may feel that this album that she may love and wants to define on her/their own terms is now going to be defined by something completely out of her control, and maybe completely out of the blue. I'm sure she understands that this is going to define the record to fans, to the band and even to herself. I think it's completely understandable to feel frustrated and angry about that, just as it's completely understandable for Janet to leave the band if that's what she feels like she has to do.

Absolutely. I think this is extremely likely. And, as you say, understandable.

A friend of mine pointed out that awhile back, Carrie and Corin had gotten together and started working on new songs, and that's how SK always kinda worked.
So all this pointing at Annie might be way off base. Carrie and Corin most likely already had ideas developed and one of them may have said, you know who we should get to produce this. Also judging from these tracks, they could have recorded large sections with out Janet even being there. I could see Janet easily being hurt by this "new direction" being left out of the process. That actually makes more sense than just about anything else, to me anyway.
I also remember from a Wild Flag interview, that Carrie said there was no way she could record an album or go on tour without Janet on drums. Wild Flag probably wouldn't have happened if Janet said no.

The new song, I really like the lyrics... hate the whole, NIN / Depeche Mode feel to the music for the first half. Janets drumming on the last 30 seconds though..... shes going to be missed.






also, even before Carries statement, a male drummer does seem out of the question.

Its such a shame because they were so good together.

That new song is horse shit

i honestly don't think i'll be able to muster up the interest to even do that

You guys are insufferable sometimes.

seriously, i can't believe some are defending these terrible new songs

Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

everyone else are obviously masochists for liking this new stuff

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

Oh I agree

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

Oh I agree

Okay... then why accuse them? Are you drunk?

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

Oh I agree

Okay... then why accuse them? Are you drunk?

Are you too stupid to realize I'm actually making fun of your accusations towards me?

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

Oh I agree

Okay... then why accuse them? Are you drunk?

Are you too stupid to realize I'm actually making fun of your accusations towards me?

What do you honestly think, verb?

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

Oh I agree

Okay... then why accuse them? Are you drunk?

Are you too stupid to realize I'm actually making fun of your accusations towards me?

What do you honestly think, verb?

You are a mystery to me, man

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

verb_to_trust wrote:Snatch and Trag are clearly misogynists for not liking this new stuff.

That seems like a pretty heavy accusation to level at them and wildly out of bounds.

Oh I agree

Okay... then why accuse them? Are you drunk?

Are you too stupid to realize I'm actually making fun of your accusations towards me?

What do you honestly think, verb?

You are a mystery to me, man

*shrugs*