Red Mosquito

Anders wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:None of these old guard are necessary for this trilogy at all. They have been nothing but a burden creatively.

It has really seemed that way at times.

None of them have been a burden. That's a weird thing to say. All of them have played an interesting and vital role in the story so far. But Leia isn't done. It's a shame that they'll force things. But here we are.

durdencommatyler wrote:

Strat wrote:Okay, lets talk about who could replace Fisher to play princess leia. Seriously! Who'd be good for that ?

Annette Bening would be my first choice. I'd actually love Laura Dern to have done it, but that can't happen now. How about Meryl Streep who basically played Carrie in Postcards from the Edge? There are a ton of options.

I think if you have Kathleen Kennedy and Billy Lorde and JJ Abrams do a presser/announcement and tell fans that this sucks but we need to embrace this because it's best for the story and what Carrie would have wanted and I think people will jump on board pretty quickly.

They might. I might. But actually seeing it on screen may take me out of the moment.

But ultimately, where we disagree, i dont see how she is absolutely necessary for moving the story forward at this point.

joey, are you mad at me?

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Anders wrote:We really need her, the story needs her. She was amazing in this movie. But out of respect for Carrie, a recasting would be wrong.

I just do not understand this line of thinking.

How do you feel about recasting Han in the upcoming movie?

100% fine with it. I'm sure you can find posts to that effect from back when it was announced. An actor isn't a character.

Eh? I mean, these actors made the characters who they are. You dont have princess leia without that sas, wit, and charm that Carrie Fisher brought. You dont have Han solo without Harrison Ford being a real life han solo and indiana jones.

Those characters were created to an extent and influenced and grown by the actors, but i can see how another actor could move the character forward or continue on.

I'm a writer who comes from a theater background. Characters should come first. Of course certain actors bring them to live and can make them iconic. But I don't believe a single actor is bigger than a character. No one is irreplaceable to me. The writing had as much to do with those characters becoming iconic as the actor did. Actors are invaluable. They can make all the difference. But none of them should come before the character, especially in situations like this where the character WOULD have continued had the actor not passed away. We shouldn't let an actor (and frankly a mediocre actor) dictate how a character develops and whether or not that iconic character lives on.

I think audiences can, will and should embrace someone else playing Leia if that's what the story demands. But, again, it's just my opinion. And I'm clearly in the minority because LITERALLY EVERYONE is against me on this. So be it. I can just tell already that Ep 9 will not be as great as it could have been.

Unless you really trust JJ Abrams to make this work. I'm a massive JJ fan. Probably one of his biggest (at least here on RM) and I can't imagine how he'll pull it off. But it's moot. They aren't recasting her. And I just have to deal with it. It's a bummer. The movie won't be as good, the story won't be as rich as it should have been.

Oh well, oh well

Strat wrote:joey, are you mad at me?

oh heavens no!

VinylGuy wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:

wease wrote:“Don’t fight what you hate, save what you love.”

This phony optimism made me want to throw up in he theater

The political subtext was awful. So fucking PC is almost right wing.

what was PC about this movie?

durdencommatyler wrote:

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Anders wrote:We really need her, the story needs her. She was amazing in this movie. But out of respect for Carrie, a recasting would be wrong.

I just do not understand this line of thinking.

How do you feel about recasting Han in the upcoming movie?

100% fine with it. I'm sure you can find posts to that effect from back when it was announced. An actor isn't a character.

Eh? I mean, these actors made the characters who they are. You dont have princess leia without that sas, wit, and charm that Carrie Fisher brought. You dont have Han solo without Harrison Ford being a real life han solo and indiana jones.

Those characters were created to an extent and influenced and grown by the actors, but i can see how another actor could move the character forward or continue on.

I'm a writer who comes from a theater background. Characters should come first. Of course certain actors bring them to live and can make them iconic. But I don't believe a single actor is bigger than a character. No one is irreplaceable to me. The writing had as much to do with those characters becoming iconic as the actor did. Actors are invaluable. They can make all the difference. But none of them should come before the character, especially in situations like this where the character WOULD have continued had the actor not passed away. We shouldn't let an actor (and frankly a mediocre actor) dictate how a character develops and whether or not that iconic character lives on.

I think audiences can, will and should embrace someone else playing Leia if that's what the story demands. But, again, it's just my opinion. And I'm clearly in the minority because LITERALLY EVERYONE is against me on this. So be it. I can just tell already that Ep 9 will not be as great as it could have been.

Unless you really trust JJ Abrams to make this work. I'm a massive JJ fan. Probably one of his biggest (at least here on RM) and I can't imagine how he'll pull it off. But it's moot. They aren't recasting her. And I just have to deal with it. It's a bummer. The movie won't be as good, the story won't be as rich as it should have been.

Oh well, oh well

I agree with damn near everything you said above except for the notion that the story will suffer because of it. This story is about Rey, Ren, Poe, and Finn. Im disappointed Leia won't be in it. Absolutely.

Do you guys think they will use Mark Hamill more (or even less) now that this has happened with Carrie?

I have no problems with Leia not being in the next film. The scene where the bridge of her ship got blown I was thinking 'Well that's a bold move killing her off so soon' and I was down with it. Her whole space walk saving herself moment didn't make me think of her as being super strong with the force since she's not being shown before to use force abilities - it just seemed lazy and pissed off they went that route.

durdencommatyler wrote:

Anders wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:None of these old guard are necessary for this trilogy at all. They have been nothing but a burden creatively.

It has really seemed that way at times.

None of them have been a burden. That's a weird thing to say. All of them have played an interesting and vital role in the story so far. But Leia isn't done. It's a shame that they'll force things. But here we are.

they have each been used to further develop our primary characters without upstaging them. their use has been wonderful

maybe they just won't make IX now

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Strat wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Anders wrote:We really need her, the story needs her. She was amazing in this movie. But out of respect for Carrie, a recasting would be wrong.

I just do not understand this line of thinking.

How do you feel about recasting Han in the upcoming movie?

100% fine with it. I'm sure you can find posts to that effect from back when it was announced. An actor isn't a character.

Eh? I mean, these actors made the characters who they are. You dont have princess leia without that sas, wit, and charm that Carrie Fisher brought. You dont have Han solo without Harrison Ford being a real life han solo and indiana jones.

Those characters were created to an extent and influenced and grown by the actors, but i can see how another actor could move the character forward or continue on.

I'm a writer who comes from a theater background. Characters should come first. Of course certain actors bring them to live and can make them iconic. But I don't believe a single actor is bigger than a character. No one is irreplaceable to me. The writing had as much to do with those characters becoming iconic as the actor did. Actors are invaluable. They can make all the difference. But none of them should come before the character, especially in situations like this where the character WOULD have continued had the actor not passed away. We shouldn't let an actor (and frankly a mediocre actor) dictate how a character develops and whether or not that iconic character lives on.

I think audiences can, will and should embrace someone else playing Leia if that's what the story demands. But, again, it's just my opinion. And I'm clearly in the minority because LITERALLY EVERYONE is against me on this. So be it. I can just tell already that Ep 9 will not be as great as it could have been.

Unless you really trust JJ Abrams to make this work. I'm a massive JJ fan. Probably one of his biggest (at least here on RM) and I can't imagine how he'll pull it off. But it's moot. They aren't recasting her. And I just have to deal with it. It's a bummer. The movie won't be as good, the story won't be as rich as it should have been.

Oh well, oh well

I agree with damn near everything you said above except for the notion that the story will suffer because of it. This story is about Rey, Ren, Poe, and Finn. Im disappointed Leia won't be in it. Absolutely.

I won't keep going around in circles about this because it's just oh so silly. We took away different things from the film. And that's, obviously, okay -- preferred even! So, I'll just say that I hear what you're saying. And I'll concede that most people seem to agree with you. Hopefully, the next film will feel complete without Leia. I'm just having a hard time imagining that now that I've seen TLJ. I would have agreed with you before I saw the film. I was a big fan of the "off-screen" death until I saw this movie. Now...

Carrie's loss feels massive. They had big plans for her. You throw in all the new canon stuff about how powerful she is in the Force, how Yoda wanted to train her, how she's able to remember her mother, all of that stuff, coupled with what she's able to do in TLJ... MAN! I can't believe people are so willing to just dismiss Leia's survival as just some dumb/weird thing that happened in the new weird Star Wars movie.

But again, I've only seen it once. Maybe my mind will change the more I watch it.

Rangi Guy wrote:I have no problems with Leia not being in the next film. The scene where the bridge of her ship got blown I was thinking 'Well that's a bold move killing her off so soon' and I was down with it. Her whole space walk saving herself moment didn't make me think of her as being super strong with the force since she's not being shown before to use force abilities - it just seemed lazy and pissed off they went that route.

She's a skywalker. She had felt Lukes presence in the OT and had those comments about remembering/not remembering her mother. WE know she is strong with the force. Nothing else needed to be said or done to know that Leia is also a powerful force woman.

There is a lot of messaging directed at very current events and politics in TLJ.

Which is ok given starwars always did that. But it’s really really going for it here.

Anders wrote:Do you guys think they will use Mark Hamill more (or even less) now that this has happened with Carrie?

I believe Mark will be instrumental now that Carrie is gone. All of the things she was meant to do in helping Rey will now go to Luke. I still expect Luke to appear/communicate with Kylo, too. But now he'll have to be a much bigger role. All of the Force stuff Carrie was going to do will be Mark's.

Strat wrote:Okay, lets talk about who could replace Fisher to play princess leia. Seriously! Who'd be good for that ?

Stevie Nicks

Rangi Guy wrote:I have no problems with Leia not being in the next film. The scene where the bridge of her ship got blown I was thinking 'Well that's a bold move killing her off so soon' and I was down with it. Her whole space walk saving herself moment didn't make me think of her as being super strong with the force since she's not being shown before to use force abilities - it just seemed lazy and pissed off they went that route.

stip wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

Anders wrote:

LoathedVermin72 wrote:None of these old guard are necessary for this trilogy at all. They have been nothing but a burden creatively.

It has really seemed that way at times.

None of them have been a burden. That's a weird thing to say. All of them have played an interesting and vital role in the story so far. But Leia isn't done. It's a shame that they'll force things. But here we are.

they have each been used to further develop our primary characters without upstaging them. their use has been wonderful

100% agree.

spike wrote:maybe they just won't make IX now