Red Mosquito

Rangi Guy wrote:

In the early incarnations of the Star Wars storyline, lightsabers were not exclusive to the Jedi and other Force-users, but were in fact very mundane. Early concept art depicts lightsabers being wielded by Rebel and Imperial soldiers alike. George Lucas later limited the lightsabers to exclusively the Jedi in order to make them feel more unique, and heighten the mystique of the Jedi. Also, in early drafts of the script, lightsabers were referred to as "lazerswords." Lightsabers being used by factions other than the Jedi or Sith, however, would later be used in-canon with Stormtrooper clones with the genetic templates of Cuis.[1]

Strat wrote:In the early incarnations of the Star Wars storyline, lightsabers were not exclusive to the Jedi and other Force-users, but were in fact very mundane. Early concept art depicts lightsabers being wielded by Rebel and Imperial soldiers alike. George Lucas later limited the lightsabers to exclusively the Jedi in order to make them feel more unique, and heighten the mystique of the Jedi. Also, in early drafts of the script, lightsabers were referred to as "lazerswords." Lightsabers being used by factions other than the Jedi or Sith, however, would later be used in-canon with Stormtrooper clones with the genetic templates of Cuis.[1]

[1]

durdencommatyler wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:Stop. Rian is a huge fan. Forcing this narrative is absurd.

Its just a feel Joe, please let me share my feelings.

You can feel whatever you want. I just want to give you facts, too. That way your feelings can change and you don't have to feel that way anymore.

Its a fact too thats weird for Luke to call them that way. That, summed up with the parody scenes at the beginning led me to feel he dont like the mythos of SW.

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:There were a few things in the script that took me out of the SW universe for a moment. It felt strange these were in there. I know these people speak English, but still.

• Luke calling light sabers 'laser swords'.
• Poe saying 'What the hell?' (floor panel falls off salt glider).
• "Godspeed". Seriously, what the fuck? Did some moron forget they should be saying "May the force be with you"? This was probably the worst stupidity. I mean fuck.
• There's an insult thrown at some point, but I can't remember exactly what it was. I think it was "bastard" or a similar. Now, I'm not 100% certain but I htink most insults in the previous movies have been made up for that universe - like "nerf herder", "bantha poodoo" etc.

I think there were more, I'll add them if I remember them (or after I see this again on Friday).

Finn "where did the crystal critters go?"

The more i think about this movie the more i love this movie.

@SkitchP wrote:The more i think about this movie the more i love this movie.

Team Skitch.

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:

@SkitchP wrote:The more i think about this movie the more i love this movie.

Team Skitch.

lol how did Sarge and Skitch start getting along. Rian Johnson FIXED EVERYTHING

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:Stop. Rian is a huge fan. Forcing this narrative is absurd.

Its just a feel Joe, please let me share my feelings.

You can feel whatever you want. I just want to give you facts, too. That way your feelings can change and you don't have to feel that way anymore.

Its a fact too thats weird for Luke to call them that way. That, summed up with the parody scenes at the beginning led me to feel he dont like the mythos of SW.

Luke is specifically using that phrase to disparage the Jedi - not as a mouthpiece for the director (who has been quite vocal in his absolute love of star wars) but because it communicated the state of mind of the character delivering the line by showing, not telling. That is the essence of good writing.

stip wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:Stop. Rian is a huge fan. Forcing this narrative is absurd.

Its just a feel Joe, please let me share my feelings.

You can feel whatever you want. I just want to give you facts, too. That way your feelings can change and you don't have to feel that way anymore.

Its a fact too thats weird for Luke to call them that way. That, summed up with the parody scenes at the beginning led me to feel he dont like the mythos of SW.

Luke is specifically using that phrase to disparage the Jedi - not as a mouthpiece for the director (who has been quite vocal in his absolute love of star wars) but because it communicated the state of mind of the character delivering the line by showing, not telling. That is the essence of good writing.

Thats your feeling Stip and its ok.

I dont think thats good writing at all. I think Rian spoofing SW with all the parody, Luke´s throwing saber at the beginning after how TFA ended, and those little things is showing he doesnt care about were those characters come from.

Man, he even says it with Kylo.

I'm simply stoked there were no moments in this movie akin to "sand that gets everywhere it’s course and irritating".

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:I'm simply stoked there were no moments in this movie akin to "sand that gets everywhere it’s course and irritating".

20 minutes of extra scenes for the DVD/BR released. Rian spoke about some of them recently:

“Again I will give the caveat that the movie is better as a whole without any of them, but yeah man, there was some great stuff. There’s a whole extended sequence where Finn and Rose and DJ sneak through the Mega Destroyer when they’re kind of, after they sneak in with DJ and they’re trying to find the tracker. There’s a whole extended sequence. It’s a full sequence of like stuff with them sneaking through this big office area of the Mega Destroyer and then having to fake out these Stormtroopers.”

“And then on the island there’s a massive sequence that we shot with Daisy and Mark, which is kind of an additional sort of trial/test that she goes through, that involves her and Mark, and then a big emotional scene between the two of them. I mean, it’s big stuff, it’s like actual real scenes.”

“There’s an extended sequence with Rey and the caretakers, which are the Nun-like fish creatures. That’s actually one of the biggest things that was taken out of the movie. And there’s this incursion on Snoke’s ship, I mean there’s a lot of stuff that was cut out of that, with Rose and DJ and Finn, and some of it is particularly fun.”

“There’s some really nice stuff in there, but we actually cut that stuff pretty early because it was very clear that that section of the movie was completely lopsided in favor of those three, and it just didn’t support it. But it’s good stuff. It’s really good stuff. I assume when you’ll see it, you’ll enjoy it because I mean, we all did. It was cut early, and how you always know is like my staff, there’s a decent number of assistants and collaborators that work in the cutting room, and they were all complaining when we cut the sequence. And that’s how you know that it was something that people like.”

“There’s a couple Finn scenes that—there’s one great Finn/Poe scene that’s kind of a set up scene at the beginning when Poe was kind of bringing Finn up to speed after he comes out of his coma. God, there’s a bunch of really fun stuff. Yeah, anyway, we talk more about them when the Blu-ray comes out, but I’m excited for folks to see them.”

Last but not least Johnson confirmed that yes, there will be a blooper reel.

VinylGuy wrote:

stip wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:

VinylGuy wrote:

durdencommatyler wrote:Stop. Rian is a huge fan. Forcing this narrative is absurd.

Its just a feel Joe, please let me share my feelings.

You can feel whatever you want. I just want to give you facts, too. That way your feelings can change and you don't have to feel that way anymore.

Its a fact too thats weird for Luke to call them that way. That, summed up with the parody scenes at the beginning led me to feel he dont like the mythos of SW.

Luke is specifically using that phrase to disparage the Jedi - not as a mouthpiece for the director (who has been quite vocal in his absolute love of star wars) but because it communicated the state of mind of the character delivering the line by showing, not telling. That is the essence of good writing.

Thats your feeling Stip and its ok.

I dont think thats good writing at all. I think Rian spoofing SW with all the parody, Luke´s throwing saber at the beginning after how TFA ended, and those little things is showing he doesnt care about were those characters come from.

Man, he even says it with Kylo.

So Luke should have immediately come out of his self imposed exile ready to train Jedi and be the hero of legend because some chick he just met handed him his old lightsaber? The look on Luke's face at the end of TFA is a mix of panic and regret. He wasn't rarin' to go.


Every one of Luke's actions are logical and intelligible given his state of mind and the circumstances that led him there - from his unwillingness to train Rey to his eventual sacrifice of himself to embrace the utility of his legend - one that others need even if he doesn't. If you don't enjoy that arc, so be it, but from the standpoint of craft and storytelling it is extremely well done. Respectful as well, in that it takes the characters seriously as dynamic people.


It is entirely possible that if RJ was writing the first episode of the series he would have written Luke differently. But what he does is probably the only way to actually treat Luke seriously as a character given the situation he inherited.


Granted neither of us are writers - but knowing that Luke

A: started to train a new order of Jedi
B: trained his nephew
C: could not prevent the dark side corruption of his nephew
D: watched his nephew slaughter his students
E: abandoned his family and friends because of his grief
F: abandoned his responsibilities because of his grief
and G: Took steps to make sure he could not be found

how do you think he should have reacted to a stranger showing up, unannounced and unasked for, and presenting you with a symbol of everything you voluntarily walked away from.

That's all from TFA. Rian Johnson picks up at exactly that moment. How would you have him respond (keeping in mind as well that his treatment of Rey somewhat parallels his own treatment by Yoda, who would have ignored Luke had Obi Wan not intervened)?

All good points, stip.

The best point is about Yoda refusing to train luke. Obi Wan had to convince him. Yoda was also in self exile.

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:All good points, stip.

The best point is about Yoda refusing to train luke. Obi Wan had to convince him.

nice parallel, without simply reproducing beat for beat what happened before

stip wrote:

Sgt. Crackpot wrote:All good points, stip.

The best point is about Yoda refusing to train luke. Obi Wan had to convince him.

nice parallel, without simply reproducing beat for beat what happened before

A big part of Yoda's reluctance was Luke's age. "He is too old. Yes. Too old to begin the training.".

Rey was probably of a similar age, and also untrained.

------------------------------------

I liked the other Yoda quotes mirroring/reference to (ESB):

"All his life has he looked away to the future, the horizon. Never his mind on where he was [pokes Luke]. Hmm? What he was doing. [paces around] Adventure. Heh! Excitement. A Jedi craves not these things. [turns to Luke and points with his walking stick] You are reckless!"

Then in TLJ: "Always looking to the Horizon, you are/were".

While this isn't a close copy of ESB (ala TFA to ANH), I find many small parallels like the above.

Another is DJ initially appearing to help, but only double crossing them at the last minute akin to Lando's actions in ESB. The only difference being that Lando redeemed himself later.

Nobody got frozen in carbonite though, right?

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