Red Mosquito

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:For a long time, my feeling about Pearl Jam has been "Well, I'm OK with this sounding like this now, but...". And that's still my feeling. I agree, further down this road and eek we may have problems. But I think it's more likely that they'll begin to get frustrated, if it honestly gets that out of hand. There was that short Dutch article which said that BoB wanted them to be more commercial and they didn't want to.

My worry is they'll just say eh whatever and roll with it. Ed's already all 'yeah we sound more commercial, yeah its kind of sentimental, who wants to be difficult'. And Bo'B keeps raving about how eddies all agreable nowadays.

Plus they're still talking about how playing the songs live is way important, and these songs are easier to play then some of the older shit...

It's been obvious since at least S/T, maybe further, that they prioritise playing live now. I've seen them moving in that direction since the fans began lapping up the "Touring Band" shtick. Suddenly all their failings on record were forgiven because well, "they're a live band anyway". I've felt that frustration for years, because I want albums. I can't enjoy the concert experience nearly as often as some others, so I wish making records was a higher priority to them. But that's all old ground.

But did you see that Dutch article? It was recent, and it said that BoB would like them to be making more pop radio hits, but Ed and the band don't want to. He keeps pushing them and they don't want to go there. That's recent, so I do think there's some push and shove, even though they've generally gone for a more shiny sound with BoB. "Pop" was the intent during Backspacer (and to a slightly lesser extent, LB), and they view BoB as the expert on "pop" music, so probably go with his decisions because that's what they want at the moment. I hope it's not what they'll always want, though. I'm hoping they'll soon move forward with what BoB has taught them, and accept and disregard as necessary.

BoBs been saying that for ages though, and the band has been saying that about eddie for years. Brenden wanted them to be more commercial or whatever and they hold back, ed writes a really poppy song and then filps it upside down so its not too poppy, or they leave it off an album (sad). Its just that now they're listening to him. And eddies fixering songs to make them more poppy, which im sure gets BoB all giddy. I guess its possible that they could go back to fighting him more on it but i dont know. Plus its not even the poppy thing, its the LB/BS kind of poppy i dont like. If they were writing sads and betterman's they could plaster the radios for all i care. Its this weird kinda dated pop sound theyve got going that i dont understand.

I'm not a musician so i don't know really, but what makes me sad most of all about the whole writing songs to play live thing, is that they're saying these songs are easier to play, so they're dumbing down thier own music? Are any of thier older songs especially hard to play? Corduroy, hail hail etc? they could still be writing songs like those if they wanted to.

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:For a long time, my feeling about Pearl Jam has been "Well, I'm OK with this sounding like this now, but...". And that's still my feeling. I agree, further down this road and eek we may have problems. But I think it's more likely that they'll begin to get frustrated, if it honestly gets that out of hand. There was that short Dutch article which said that BoB wanted them to be more commercial and they didn't want to.

My worry is they'll just say eh whatever and roll with it. Ed's already all 'yeah we sound more commercial, yeah its kind of sentimental, who wants to be difficult'. And Bo'B keeps raving about how eddies all agreable nowadays.

Plus they're still talking about how playing the songs live is way important, and these songs are easier to play then some of the older shit...

It's been obvious since at least S/T, maybe further, that they prioritise playing live now. I've seen them moving in that direction since the fans began lapping up the "Touring Band" shtick. Suddenly all their failings on record were forgiven because well, "they're a live band anyway". I've felt that frustration for years, because I want albums. I can't enjoy the concert experience nearly as often as some others, so I wish making records was a higher priority to them. But that's all old ground.

But did you see that Dutch article? It was recent, and it said that BoB would like them to be making more pop radio hits, but Ed and the band don't want to. He keeps pushing them and they don't want to go there. That's recent, so I do think there's some push and shove, even though they've generally gone for a more shiny sound with BoB. "Pop" was the intent during Backspacer (and to a slightly lesser extent, LB), and they view BoB as the expert on "pop" music, so probably go with his decisions because that's what they want at the moment. I hope it's not what they'll always want, though. I'm hoping they'll soon move forward with what BoB has taught them, and accept and disregard as necessary.

BoBs been saying that for ages though, and the band has been saying that about eddie for years. Brenden wanted them to be more commercial or whatever and they hold back, ed writes a really poppy song and then filps it upside down so its not too poppy, or they leave it off an album (sad). Its just that now they're listening to him. And eddies fixering songs to make them more poppy, which im sure gets BoB all giddy. I guess its possible that they could go back to fighting him more on it but i dont know. Plus its not even the poppy thing, its the LB/BS kind of poppy i dont like. If they were writing sads and betterman's they could plaster the radios for all i care. Its this weird kinda dated pop sound theyve got going that i dont understand.

I'm not a musician so i don't know really, but what makes me sad most of all about the whole writing songs to play live thing, is that they're saying these songs are easier to play, so they're dumbing down thier own music? Are any of thier older songs especially hard to play? Corduroy, hail hail etc? they could still be writing songs like those if they wanted to.

IlluminEddie wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:For a long time, my feeling about Pearl Jam has been "Well, I'm OK with this sounding like this now, but...". And that's still my feeling. I agree, further down this road and eek we may have problems. But I think it's more likely that they'll begin to get frustrated, if it honestly gets that out of hand. There was that short Dutch article which said that BoB wanted them to be more commercial and they didn't want to.

My worry is they'll just say eh whatever and roll with it. Ed's already all 'yeah we sound more commercial, yeah its kind of sentimental, who wants to be difficult'. And Bo'B keeps raving about how eddies all agreable nowadays.

Plus they're still talking about how playing the songs live is way important, and these songs are easier to play then some of the older shit...

It's been obvious since at least S/T, maybe further, that they prioritise playing live now. I've seen them moving in that direction since the fans began lapping up the "Touring Band" shtick. Suddenly all their failings on record were forgiven because well, "they're a live band anyway". I've felt that frustration for years, because I want albums. I can't enjoy the concert experience nearly as often as some others, so I wish making records was a higher priority to them. But that's all old ground.

But did you see that Dutch article? It was recent, and it said that BoB would like them to be making more pop radio hits, but Ed and the band don't want to. He keeps pushing them and they don't want to go there. That's recent, so I do think there's some push and shove, even though they've generally gone for a more shiny sound with BoB. "Pop" was the intent during Backspacer (and to a slightly lesser extent, LB), and they view BoB as the expert on "pop" music, so probably go with his decisions because that's what they want at the moment. I hope it's not what they'll always want, though. I'm hoping they'll soon move forward with what BoB has taught them, and accept and disregard as necessary.

BoBs been saying that for ages though, and the band has been saying that about eddie for years. Brenden wanted them to be more commercial or whatever and they hold back, ed writes a really poppy song and then filps it upside down so its not too poppy, or they leave it off an album (sad). Its just that now they're listening to him. And eddies fixering songs to make them more poppy, which im sure gets BoB all giddy. I guess its possible that they could go back to fighting him more on it but i dont know. Plus its not even the poppy thing, its the LB/BS kind of poppy i dont like. If they were writing sads and betterman's they could plaster the radios for all i care. Its this weird kinda dated pop sound theyve got going that i dont understand.

I'm not a musician so i don't know really, but what makes me sad most of all about the whole writing songs to play live thing, is that they're saying these songs are easier to play, so they're dumbing down thier own music? Are any of thier older songs especially hard to play? Corduroy, hail hail etc? they could still be writing songs like those if they wanted to.

They realize that Hail Hail would bomb today if it was released (it didn't do well back then either, to be real). Corduroy would get little air time too. Betterman might do well,... might. They need to be more "current", in order to maintain relevancy. What they consider relevant, you consider it to be bad. They don't care. They know the in the long run, a commercial success right now would be best for their career. And even if they wrote their best straight up grunge rock song ever - it wouldn't cut it in today's environment. They need a hit. They're trying to get one. I think they know what's best for their longevity. It's not writing depressing grunge sound until they pass away. They need a broader reach.

As far as difficulty goes, on average, this stuff is probably on pace with everything they've done in the past.

Mine wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:For a long time, my feeling about Pearl Jam has been "Well, I'm OK with this sounding like this now, but...". And that's still my feeling. I agree, further down this road and eek we may have problems. But I think it's more likely that they'll begin to get frustrated, if it honestly gets that out of hand. There was that short Dutch article which said that BoB wanted them to be more commercial and they didn't want to.

My worry is they'll just say eh whatever and roll with it. Ed's already all 'yeah we sound more commercial, yeah its kind of sentimental, who wants to be difficult'. And Bo'B keeps raving about how eddies all agreable nowadays.

Plus they're still talking about how playing the songs live is way important, and these songs are easier to play then some of the older shit...

It's been obvious since at least S/T, maybe further, that they prioritise playing live now. I've seen them moving in that direction since the fans began lapping up the "Touring Band" shtick. Suddenly all their failings on record were forgiven because well, "they're a live band anyway". I've felt that frustration for years, because I want albums. I can't enjoy the concert experience nearly as often as some others, so I wish making records was a higher priority to them. But that's all old ground.

But did you see that Dutch article? It was recent, and it said that BoB would like them to be making more pop radio hits, but Ed and the band don't want to. He keeps pushing them and they don't want to go there. That's recent, so I do think there's some push and shove, even though they've generally gone for a more shiny sound with BoB. "Pop" was the intent during Backspacer (and to a slightly lesser extent, LB), and they view BoB as the expert on "pop" music, so probably go with his decisions because that's what they want at the moment. I hope it's not what they'll always want, though. I'm hoping they'll soon move forward with what BoB has taught them, and accept and disregard as necessary.

BoBs been saying that for ages though, and the band has been saying that about eddie for years. Brenden wanted them to be more commercial or whatever and they hold back, ed writes a really poppy song and then filps it upside down so its not too poppy, or they leave it off an album (sad). Its just that now they're listening to him. And eddies fixering songs to make them more poppy, which im sure gets BoB all giddy. I guess its possible that they could go back to fighting him more on it but i dont know. Plus its not even the poppy thing, its the LB/BS kind of poppy i dont like. If they were writing sads and betterman's they could plaster the radios for all i care. Its this weird kinda dated pop sound theyve got going that i dont understand.

I'm not a musician so i don't know really, but what makes me sad most of all about the whole writing songs to play live thing, is that they're saying these songs are easier to play, so they're dumbing down thier own music? Are any of thier older songs especially hard to play? Corduroy, hail hail etc? they could still be writing songs like those if they wanted to.

They realize that Hail Hail would bomb today if it was released (it didn't do well back then either, to be real). Corduroy would get little air time too. Betterman might do well,... might. They need to be more "current", in order to maintain relevancy. What they consider relevant, you consider it to be bad. They don't care. They know the in the long run, a commercial success right now would be best for their career. And even if they wrote their best straight up grunge rock song ever - it wouldn't cut it in today's environment. They need a hit. They're trying to get one. I think they know what's best for their longevity. It's not writing depressing grunge sound until they pass away. They need a broader reach.

As far as difficulty goes, on average, this stuff is probably on pace with everything they've done in the past.

I don't see what could realistically be a hit on this album to be honest. I think they just got older and their taste changed but people want them to be their 20 or 30 something selves. I don't see anything more complex behind their music.
They don't really need a hit, whether they want one i don't know if they are they are extremely clueless.

IlluminEddie wrote:

Mine wrote:

IlluminEddie wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:

stupidmop wrote:

harmless wrote:For a long time, my feeling about Pearl Jam has been "Well, I'm OK with this sounding like this now, but...". And that's still my feeling. I agree, further down this road and eek we may have problems. But I think it's more likely that they'll begin to get frustrated, if it honestly gets that out of hand. There was that short Dutch article which said that BoB wanted them to be more commercial and they didn't want to.

My worry is they'll just say eh whatever and roll with it. Ed's already all 'yeah we sound more commercial, yeah its kind of sentimental, who wants to be difficult'. And Bo'B keeps raving about how eddies all agreable nowadays.

Plus they're still talking about how playing the songs live is way important, and these songs are easier to play then some of the older shit...

It's been obvious since at least S/T, maybe further, that they prioritise playing live now. I've seen them moving in that direction since the fans began lapping up the "Touring Band" shtick. Suddenly all their failings on record were forgiven because well, "they're a live band anyway". I've felt that frustration for years, because I want albums. I can't enjoy the concert experience nearly as often as some others, so I wish making records was a higher priority to them. But that's all old ground.

But did you see that Dutch article? It was recent, and it said that BoB would like them to be making more pop radio hits, but Ed and the band don't want to. He keeps pushing them and they don't want to go there. That's recent, so I do think there's some push and shove, even though they've generally gone for a more shiny sound with BoB. "Pop" was the intent during Backspacer (and to a slightly lesser extent, LB), and they view BoB as the expert on "pop" music, so probably go with his decisions because that's what they want at the moment. I hope it's not what they'll always want, though. I'm hoping they'll soon move forward with what BoB has taught them, and accept and disregard as necessary.

BoBs been saying that for ages though, and the band has been saying that about eddie for years. Brenden wanted them to be more commercial or whatever and they hold back, ed writes a really poppy song and then filps it upside down so its not too poppy, or they leave it off an album (sad). Its just that now they're listening to him. And eddies fixering songs to make them more poppy, which im sure gets BoB all giddy. I guess its possible that they could go back to fighting him more on it but i dont know. Plus its not even the poppy thing, its the LB/BS kind of poppy i dont like. If they were writing sads and betterman's they could plaster the radios for all i care. Its this weird kinda dated pop sound theyve got going that i dont understand.

I'm not a musician so i don't know really, but what makes me sad most of all about the whole writing songs to play live thing, is that they're saying these songs are easier to play, so they're dumbing down thier own music? Are any of thier older songs especially hard to play? Corduroy, hail hail etc? they could still be writing songs like those if they wanted to.

They realize that Hail Hail would bomb today if it was released (it didn't do well back then either, to be real). Corduroy would get little air time too. Betterman might do well,... might. They need to be more "current", in order to maintain relevancy. What they consider relevant, you consider it to be bad. They don't care. They know the in the long run, a commercial success right now would be best for their career. And even if they wrote their best straight up grunge rock song ever - it wouldn't cut it in today's environment. They need a hit. They're trying to get one. I think they know what's best for their longevity. It's not writing depressing grunge sound until they pass away. They need a broader reach.

As far as difficulty goes, on average, this stuff is probably on pace with everything they've done in the past.

I don't see what could realistically be a hit on this album to be honest. I think they just got older and their taste changed but people want them to be their 20 or 30 something selves. I don't see anything more complex behind their music.
They don't really need a hit, whether they want one i don't know if they are they are extremely clueless.

They want a hit. Sirens or Sleeping By Myself could be hits because they could cross-over. That's their problem. They have a lot of trouble crossing over. They aren't stupid. They know what they are doing and think about more than any of us. They put these songs out because they want more listeners.

Mine wrote:Cross-over to what? I presume it depends on how big a hit you have in mind. Sirens is nearly 6 minutes long that's if it's a hit you're after you make 4 minutes at most and that doesn't even start to address the actual music. Sirens can at best give them some attention for about a month. If they wanted a hit they'd be all over promoting it and playing whatever they want to be the hit. Sleeping by Myself is as anti single as it gets. It isn't as much crossover as it lacks any specific style especially those that end up in the top40.

McParadigm wrote:

Mine wrote:Cross-over to what? I presume it depends on how big a hit you have in mind. Sirens is nearly 6 minutes long that's if it's a hit you're after you make 4 minutes at most and that doesn't even start to address the actual music. Sirens can at best give them some attention for about a month. If they wanted a hit they'd be all over promoting it and playing whatever they want to be the hit. Sleeping by Myself is as anti single as it gets. It isn't as much crossover as it lacks any specific style especially those that end up in the top40.

Sirens is crossing over from the three formats that define their radio career (all rock formats) to the same adult radio formats that made Just Breathe and Last Kiss standout successes. It's already approaching Just Breathe's peak numbers on adult radio, and is doing just fine on the traditional rock formats.

Whatever else these songs are, they are certainly radio friendly.

-

Side note: Pearl Jam has never really pushed their songs on radio in any way since, like, Alive....but do you know what band has always been absolutely crazy at inner-industry promotion? Like, barely falling short of sucking off programmers to get their songs played? Ever since jump?

Alice in Chains. True story.

Print ads, personal letters and recorded messages, whatever this is:



, and so on into eternity. Man, those guys must just live for hearing themselves on radio.

McParadigm wrote:

Mine wrote:Cross-over to what? I presume it depends on how big a hit you have in mind. Sirens is nearly 6 minutes long that's if it's a hit you're after you make 4 minutes at most and that doesn't even start to address the actual music. Sirens can at best give them some attention for about a month. If they wanted a hit they'd be all over promoting it and playing whatever they want to be the hit. Sleeping by Myself is as anti single as it gets. It isn't as much crossover as it lacks any specific style especially those that end up in the top40.

Sirens is crossing over from the three formats that define their radio career (all rock formats) to the same adult radio formats that made Just Breathe and Last Kiss standout successes. It's already approaching Just Breathe's peak numbers on adult radio, and is doing just fine on the traditional rock formats.

Whatever else these songs are, they are certainly radio friendly.

-

Side note: Pearl Jam has never really pushed their songs on radio in any way since, like, Alive....but do you know what band has always been absolutely crazy at inner-industry promotion? Like, barely falling short of sucking off programmers to get their songs played? Ever since jump?

Alice in Chains. True story.

Print ads, personal letters and recorded messages, whatever this is:



, and so on into eternity. Man, those guys must just live for hearing themselves on radio.

McParadigm wrote:

Mine wrote:Cross-over to what? I presume it depends on how big a hit you have in mind. Sirens is nearly 6 minutes long that's if it's a hit you're after you make 4 minutes at most and that doesn't even start to address the actual music. Sirens can at best give them some attention for about a month. If they wanted a hit they'd be all over promoting it and playing whatever they want to be the hit. Sleeping by Myself is as anti single as it gets. It isn't as much crossover as it lacks any specific style especially those that end up in the top40.

Sirens is crossing over from the three formats that define their radio career (all rock formats) to the same adult radio formats that made Just Breathe and Last Kiss standout successes. It's already approaching Just Breathe's peak numbers on adult radio, and is doing just fine on the traditional rock formats.

Whatever else these songs are, they are certainly radio friendly.

-

Side note: Pearl Jam has never really pushed their songs on radio in any way since, like, Alive....but do you know what band has always been absolutely crazy at inner-industry promotion? Like, barely falling short of sucking off programmers to get their songs played? Ever since jump?

Alice in Chains. True story.

Print ads, personal letters and recorded messages, whatever this is:



, and so on into eternity. Man, those guys must just live for hearing themselves on radio.

stip wrote:In general I like what BoB did on this record. I have problems with future days, but they aren't BoB problems.

BurtReynolds wrote:

McParadigm wrote:

Mine wrote:Cross-over to what? I presume it depends on how big a hit you have in mind. Sirens is nearly 6 minutes long that's if it's a hit you're after you make 4 minutes at most and that doesn't even start to address the actual music. Sirens can at best give them some attention for about a month. If they wanted a hit they'd be all over promoting it and playing whatever they want to be the hit. Sleeping by Myself is as anti single as it gets. It isn't as much crossover as it lacks any specific style especially those that end up in the top40.

Sirens is crossing over from the three formats that define their radio career (all rock formats) to the same adult radio formats that made Just Breathe and Last Kiss standout successes. It's already approaching Just Breathe's peak numbers on adult radio, and is doing just fine on the traditional rock formats.

Whatever else these songs are, they are certainly radio friendly.

-

Side note: Pearl Jam has never really pushed their songs on radio in any way since, like, Alive....but do you know what band has always been absolutely crazy at inner-industry promotion? Like, barely falling short of sucking off programmers to get their songs played? Ever since jump?

Alice in Chains. True story.

Print ads, personal letters and recorded messages, whatever this is:



, and so on into eternity. Man, those guys must just live for hearing themselves on radio.

everything including sucking off Nickelback.

harmless wrote:How many of you, in listening to PJ's music, were actually running from the jaws of something you perceived as musically horrible, and finding safety? It seems like it was a lot of you.

harmless wrote:How many of you, in listening to PJ's music, were actually running from the jaws of something you perceived as musically horrible, and finding safety? It seems like it was a lot of you.