Red Mosquito

Everyone involved is wrong

If DeSantis & Abbott represent their states, why do they have to work so hard for their citizens to not vote? They represent just as small a margin as any other politician.

It would be one thing to work through the process of scheduling these people to appear in court in Boston and then fly them to Boston. Immagrants/asylum seekers get relocated within the states all the time. If the process is a problem, let's work to solve that.

What I'm calling malice, and what these theatrics are creating, is a scenario where these govenors are deliberately stacking the already burdensome process against these people. It's mean and human beings don't deserve to be treated like this. Now crabs? You can treat crabs like this. Fuck you, Crabs!

Bi_3 wrote:The people in those states have an outsized burden on them to care for illegal immigrants. It is incredibly disruptive and damaging for those states. You might even called it a 'disparate impact'. And for the people who have to deal with this and the impacts on public health and public safety every single day to have to sit there listen while they are called bigots and white supremacists for want to stop millions from crossing that border each year by people who have little skin in this game.

I feel this is disingenuous given that DeSantis had to go to Texas to find asylum seekers to fly to Martha's Vineyard. If Florida is crumbling under the burden, why didn't he send some of the people who were burdening his state?

Or or or!!!! Maybe he could take the federal money for Medicaid expansion and limit some of the impact on public health.

Definitely citation needed for that Bi_3 claim.

Mickey wrote:Definitely citation needed for that Bi_3 claim.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pentagon-d ... ant-buses/

Bi_3 wrote:

Mickey wrote:Definitely citation needed for that Bi_3 claim.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pentagon-d ... ant-buses/

Sure. I meant the claim that Florida and Texas--and not just the state governments but "the people in those states"--"have an outsized burden on them to care for illegal immigrants" compared to Massachusetts (sure, probably), New York (doubtful), or another large blue state with plenty of municipal sanctuary laws (no way). Or the correlative claim that this immigration is "incredibly disruptive and damaging," in particular through its impact on "public health and public safety"--again, not just in itself but in comparison to the effects felt by the blue states in question here.

For instance, this Pew research data from 2019 (but measured up to 2016) suggests that Texas and California have about the same percentage of illegal immigrants relative to their overall population (5.7% and 5.6%, respectively), with an identical percentage of children of undocumented adults in their school systems (13.3%). Likewise, Florida and New York (and D.C. and Georgia and Massachusetts!) are all pretty comparable--raw numbers of course differ, but illegal immigrants represent 3.8% of their entire population in each case except for New York (3.6%). Florida does have slightly more children of undocumented adults in their school system than New York (7.1% to 6.6%, respectively), but the children of illegal immigrants represented 9% of school-aged children in DC. So it's not at all clear that Florida and Texas are being uniquely taxed here--certainly more-so than North Dakota, but not necessarily relative to other large states with significant population and transit hubs.

https://www.pewresearch.org/hispanic/in ... -by-state/

I'm not saying that this proves you wrong. But I am saying that it is not at all self-evident that Abbott and DeSantis are dealing with unique situations or that their voting blocs are uniquely put-upon in a material (rather than fantastical) way. This is the newest reputable data set I could find. Would be interested to see something more up-to-date beyond anecdotal cases, if such a thing exists.

Mickey seems like he would be a cool guy to hang out with

Interview me and you'll see how fun I am.

That’s a very fair question Mickey. Let me think on that as I’m not sure where such data might exist. One thing to consider is that many immigrants in places like New York and Massachusetts likely first travelled through and spent some amount of time in places like AZ or Texas before they became “settled”.

I have another thought. Since part of the reason there are so many immigrants stuck in the border states is because our courts are so backed up. Was it smart to wise a bunch of them to other parts of the country, making INS postpone and reschedule their hearings, and thus backing the courts up further?

B wrote:I have another thought. Since part of the reason there are so many immigrants stuck in the border states is because our courts are so backed up. Was it smart to wise a bunch of them to other parts of the country, making INS postpone and reschedule their hearings, and thus backing the courts up further?

Wait, are you saying these guys aren't acting in good faith?

Norris wrote:

B wrote:I have another thought. Since part of the reason there are so many immigrants stuck in the border states is because our courts are so backed up. Was it smart to wise a bunch of them to other parts of the country, making INS postpone and reschedule their hearings, and thus backing the courts up further?

Wait, are you saying these guys aren't acting in good faith?

Are you saying that Desantis is throwing his taxpayers under the bus in order to pull off a political stunt in support of a possible future Presidential campaign?

Mickey wrote:For instance, this Pew research data from 2019 (but measured up to 2016) suggests that Texas and California have about the same percentage of illegal immigrants relative to their overall population (5.7% and 5.6%, respectively), with an identical percentage of children of undocumented adults in their school systems (13.3%). Likewise, Florida and New York (and D.C. and Georgia and Massachusetts!) are all pretty comparable--raw numbers of course differ, but illegal immigrants represent 3.8% of their entire population in each case except for New York (3.6%). Florida does have slightly more children of undocumented adults in their school system than New York (7.1% to 6.6%, respectively), but the children of illegal immigrants represented 9% of school-aged children in DC. So it's not at all clear that Florida and Texas are being uniquely taxed here--certainly more-so than North Dakota, but not necessarily relative to other large states with significant population and transit hubs.

https://www.pewresearch.org/hispanic/in ... -by-state/

I'm not saying that this proves you wrong. But I am saying that it is not at all self-evident that Abbott and DeSantis are dealing with unique situations or that their voting blocs are uniquely put-upon in a material (rather than fantastical) way. This is the newest reputable data set I could find. Would be interested to see something more up-to-date beyond anecdotal cases, if such a thing exists.

I suspect there's a difference in these states (CA and TX) between visa overstays and asylum applicants/ successful border transits.

Peak CNN reporting right here

Also this:

not for Bi