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Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Mon September 21, 2026 11:21 pm
by wease
Well, that is her name and she did leave Gotham.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Mon September 21, 2026 11:44 pm
by bada
Jorge wrote: Mon September 21, 2026 10:26 pm
Hal didn't directly kill people, but he got people killed. He deliberately engineered the armed confrontation at the Macon ranch. He knew the group of murderous aliens were extremely dangerous and capable of suicide bombings, falsely told them that Macon was the Manhunter, and sent them directly at the ranch so their attack would occupy Macon’s militia while Hal went after the real Manhunter. This helped precipitate the battle that devastated Rushville. Not to mention straight-up leaving John Stewart to die. He was overwhelmed with insecurity and paranoia, obsessed with feeling old and useless and like the ring is what defines his value. Sinestro got in his head.
The people of Rushville hate Hal's guts and think he's a bad person for what he did but I think the way the show itself treats him is much more nuanced. One of my favorite things about this last episode was the small ways in which the remnants of his goodness and humanity were displayed (by constantly trying to help people in the face of hostility and derision, and his lovey-dovey voice note to sheriff Kane)
Good ep, good show
Those aliens were gonna blow up the entire town if Hal didn't give them another target. The Manhunter was a wanted fugitive running a cult in a small town and had zero issue blowing it up. A intergalactic cop should intervene and if the bad guy starts blowing things up during the bust I don't see how its a no brainer the cop goes to jail even if he had low self esteem.
Zero issue with how the town perceives Hal they were in a cult.
John killed Zoe but Hal didn't take the fall he fell. I bet whoever wrote that line looked in the mirror after and said "you're a genius".
The John Stewart car thing...yes I guess when a character is written to do something incredible stupid they have to own it but in his defense he didn't know it was gonna catch on fire. Should he have put John in a bubble and float him to the top of a mountain to get him out of the action yes. Did the writers know that was an option? Probably but making Hal the asshole was the mission statement. I feel the writers room in every moment of this show. You can see the whiteboard.
As for the insecurity and the paranoia the Guardian wanted John to kill Hal and take the ring off his dead body. Reason to be suspicious.
....and yes the sheriff killed Hal cause Tom King.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 12:25 am
by B
The town doesn't hate Hal for people getting killed, I mean, they DO, but they really hate him (and John) because they killed the alien that kept everyone in town from dying or even getting sick.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 12:51 am
by Jorge
bada wrote: Mon September 21, 2026 11:44 pmThose aliens were gonna blow up the entire town if Hal didn't give them another target. The Manhunter was a wanted fugitive running a cult in a small town and had zero issue blowing it up. A intergalactic cop should intervene and if the bad guy starts blowing things up during the bust I don't see how its a no brainer the cop goes to jail even if he had low self esteem.
Again, he deliberately sic'd a group of extremely dangerous aliens on a civilian compound knowing they were there to kill somebody and knowing they had suicide bombs built into their bodies. He lied to Antaan that Macon was the Manhunter specifically so Antaan's people would attack the ranch and keep Macon's militia occupied while Hal went after Zoe. Hal explains the strategy himself: he's going to let Macon and Antaan "have it out," use them as a smokescreen, grab Zoe, and then go back to Oa expecting to be vindicated and keep his ring.
You can absolutely argue that this was a morally defensible strategy given that Antaan was threatening to blow up the whole town anyway. That's a different argument, though. You originally asked why Hal went to prison, and this seems like the answer. He knowingly deceived one armed group into attacking another, anticipating lethal violence as part of his plan, and people died as a result. Whether you think he made the best choice available doesn't make the legal problem disappear.
Same with John: maybe Hal didn't intend for the car to catch fire, but he deliberately crashed it, left John trapped inside and walked away. Again, you can argue about how morally culpable that makes him, but it's not hard to understand why, after the whole thing was investigated, Hal wound up doing time.
bada wrote: Mon September 21, 2026 11:44 pmHal didn't take the fall he fell. I bet whoever wrote that line looked in the mirror after and said "you're a genius".
Yeah that was a corny line. They drop in a groaner every once in a while. It reminded me of that line in the Doomsday trailer "I knew he was lost, but I didn't know he was broken." Full body cringe as those LLMy constructions at this point.
bada wrote: Mon September 21, 2026 11:44 pmAs for the insecurity and the paranoia the Guardian wanted John to kill Hal and take the ring off his dead body. Reason to be suspicious.
I don't think the Guardians wanted John to kill him? She told John to recite the oath the next time Hal gave him his ring. Did I miss anything that implies the Guardians wanted Hal dead? I really don't think that's the case. Either way, whether the paranoia and insecurity were justified doesn’t negate the fact that they’re there
bada wrote: Mon September 21, 2026 11:44 pmmaking Hal the asshole was the mission statement. I feel the writers room in every moment of this show. You can see the whiteboard.
I don't know about that. I think the mission is to craft a compelling and internally consistent character and I think that's what we're getting. Hal has been portrayed with a lot of nuance throughout, and he's tons of fun to watch. One of my favorite parts of the show has been his characterization. Probably a lot to do with Kyle Chandler too
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 1:04 am
by VinylGuy
Guys, Jorge hates Hal Jordan.
His fav Lantern is probably Kyle Rayner
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 1:27 am
by bada
Look maybe you could make a case for deceiving two groups of bad guys that killed each other....they all died so not sure who could have dimed him out but no way anything to do with John's crash was part of a trial. How would you prove a guy without a scratch was intentionally part of a car crash and burned to death but was brought back by an alien (who he was sleeping with and was married to a guy that was also killed) who promised to save him if he pledged loyalty but then she was shot in the head but definitely not by the trained sniper on site who made a big show about buying a scope? Bet John kept that all quite.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 1:28 am
by bada
Kyle Rayner is my favorite lantern....and Wally is the best Flash.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 1:10 pm
by VinylGuy
Wally over Barry Allen, well maybe i can understand that....but its Jordan first and Stewart second with Lanterns
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Tue September 22, 2026 1:19 pm
by B
I recently read Far Sector. Sojourner Mullein is a pretty bad-ass Green Lantern.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 1:32 am
by Mecca
B wrote: Tue September 22, 2026 12:25 am
The town doesn't hate Hal for people getting killed, I mean, they DO, but they really hate him (and John) because they killed the alien that kept everyone in town from dying or even getting sick.
B is right
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 2:12 am
by Jorge
Yeah but who is arguing against that
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 2:46 am
by Mecca
Jorge wrote: Wed September 23, 2026 2:12 am
Yeah but who is arguing against that
bada
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 11:54 am
by bada
bada wrote: Mon September 21, 2026 11:44 pm
Zero issue with how the town perceives Hal they were in a cult.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 12:35 pm
by Mecca
Not reading that essay
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 12:47 pm
by B
Yeah, anyhow, the show doesn't portray Hal as a bad guy, just cavalier and cocky. It's probably a commentary of thinking you're not afraid of anything. Then you just behave dangerously.
Sure, Hal was trying to save people, but then it was his plan that was getting people killed in the first place.
John didn't try to save people because he was laser focused on his target. Because he doesn't have a ring, that's his best chance of saving people, ending the conflict.
If Hal ends up a hero at the end of the show, it will because he stopped fell in love the the sheriff and had something to fear.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 1:05 pm
by wease
I’m still not sold on that theory. I think he was just gettin close to her to keep an eye on the kid.
Oh yeah, Carol Farris shows up?!? Nice to see she hasn’t been forgotten.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 1:07 pm
by VinylGuy
Yeah that was cool.
Lots of theories about Hal dead guy being a clone and the real one letting Sinestro out
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 1:09 pm
by wease
I’m thinking that he’s not dead. And the “backup” of him has something to do with it.
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 1:11 pm
by VinylGuy
Yeah me too. I wanna know when they switched. Probably Before the attack
Re: Lanterns- HBO Max
Posted: Wed September 23, 2026 2:11 pm
by B
wease wrote: Wed September 23, 2026 1:05 pm
I’m still not sold on that theory. I think he was just gettin close to her to keep an eye on the kid.
... fell in love with the sheriff and/or had something to fear.