Red Mosquito

This thread is a good sign for the new album

stip wrote:

Ledbetterman10 wrote:

theplatypus wrote:

B wrote:Anyone think this song would be better if it was 25% faster?

Here it is 25% faster. You be the judge.

Sounds a little better.

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, this is sort of how Spin The Black Circle was composed. Stone had the riff but it was way slower. Eddie wanted it faster so they sped it up and that's the song we know today. Not sure where I read that though. Maybe the PJ20 book?

I think I like this more sped up, too.

just wait til you see it live

cutuphalfdead wrote:

stip wrote:

Ledbetterman10 wrote:

theplatypus wrote:

B wrote:Anyone think this song would be better if it was 25% faster?

Here it is 25% faster. You be the judge.

Sounds a little better.

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, this is sort of how Spin The Black Circle was composed. Stone had the riff but it was way slower. Eddie wanted it faster so they sped it up and that's the song we know today. Not sure where I read that though. Maybe the PJ20 book?

I think I like this more sped up, too.

just wait til you see it live

https://youtu.be/4X4Fy8YqysY?t=3m2s

billy billy micromachenis

stip wrote:

Ledbetterman10 wrote:

tree_ wrote:I wonder if Ed plays this for his wife and she just doesn't have the heart to tell him he sounds like shit. Someone in their inner circles need to do them a favor and let them know how horrible they sound. Do all their families just pretend this kind of shit is good? What about the producer? I'm getting the impression they're all in an echo chamber, never questioning themselves or considering this shit might be bad and to actually work hard on something like they used to. They can't have just lost all their creativity and it must have to do with work ethic? Right?

I don't think it's the responsibility of a spouse or anyone else in an inner-circle to do that. I think someone else in the band has to tell him if they think something sounds like shit. But maybe they just don't think it sounds like shit.

Just ducking in for my periodic reminder that outside of Red Mosquito this was actually a pretty well received album. Not a classic, by any means, but it was well reviewed, sold well, had a huge hit. So this conversation won't happen until an album falls flat.

this kind of reasoned analysis has no place here stip.

Deferring to consensus isn't analysis

That wasn't me to consensus. That was the citing of evidence to undercut a deeply held religious conviction by a narrow circle of people.

Stip the Eternal Appeal to Authority.

stip wrote:That wasn't me to consensus. That was the citing of evidence to undercut a deeply held religious conviction by a narrow circle of people.

Evidence against what? Was someone making the argument that Backspacer had received bad reviews and sold poorly?

Because it sounds like you're using "it received good reviews and it sold well" as an argument against people saying "this sucks" and I'm pretty sure you can see the problem with that

I cannot contribute to PJ threads in other forums because it's always full of people who hate the middle period and totally buy into the "return to form with S/T" bullshit. I guess people want commercialism rather than creativity. It's sad.

theplatypus wrote:

stip wrote:That wasn't me to consensus. That was the citing of evidence to undercut a deeply held religious conviction by a narrow circle of people.

Evidence against what? Was someone making the argument that Backspacer had received bad reviews and sold poorly?

No, but there was a whole discussion about how terrible the recent albums were and how someone has an obligation to finally tell them that everything they do is awful so they could go back to making good albums. It is the dominant narrative about the last decade of the band (followed by the potentially more irritating PRAMG), and I am pointing out that this narrative probably doesn't hold up outside of this forum (or, more accurately, the disgruntled elements of the fan community). Also, that Eddie's wife, or the producer, or the band, or whoever, probably has no reason to tell Eddie or the band that everything they do sucks because their wider audience evidently doesn't see things that way.

Because it sounds like you're using "it received good reviews and it sold well" as an argument against people saying "this sucks" and I'm pretty sure you can see the problem with that

Yeah, that obviously doesn't work if the point is to tell someone that they're wrong to dislike something because other people like it. But it is, I think, a rebuttal against the idea that Pearl Jam keeps 'failing', and a reminder that RM is an echo chamber

it's not only RM that thinks backspacer aint no good, brah.

RM plus a few guys that WTOB? knows

BurtReynolds wrote:Stip the Eternal Appeal to Authority.

Yes, but at least I'm appealing to TWO gods

stip wrote:RM plus a few guys that WTOB? knows

Wendy Carlos's Twin wrote:I cannot contribute to PJ threads in other forums because it's always full of people who hate the middle period and totally buy into the "return to form with S/T" bullshit. I guess people want commercialism rather than creativity. It's sad.

Return to form? Really? People say that.

At best, I figured they found a comfortable autopilot.

B wrote:

Wendy Carlos's Twin wrote:I cannot contribute to PJ threads in other forums because it's always full of people who hate the middle period and totally buy into the "return to form with S/T" bullshit. I guess people want commercialism rather than creativity. It's sad.

Return to form? Really? People say that.

At best, I figured they found a comfortable autopilot.

Someone was arguing with me that they weren't truly "creative" until S/T, and people were agreeing. I wanted to puke. I don't know if people truly see things this way or if they are just buying into marketing hype, but it makes no sense.

That's a pretty tough sell, but there is something to the 'return to form' argument insofar as the last few albums are more immediate, accessible, outward facing albums compared to the Vitalogy - Riot Act run (with the exception of Yield). If that's what you're looking for in pearl jam, that's the approach they've adopted. How more of less 'creative' it is, how good the songs are, etc. is obviously debatable.

Wendy Carlos's Twin wrote:

B wrote:

Wendy Carlos's Twin wrote:I cannot contribute to PJ threads in other forums because it's always full of people who hate the middle period and totally buy into the "return to form with S/T" bullshit. I guess people want commercialism rather than creativity. It's sad.

Return to form? Really? People say that.

At best, I figured they found a comfortable autopilot.

Someone was arguing with me that they weren't truly "creative" until S/T, and people were agreeing. I wanted to puke. I don't know if people truly see things this way or if they are just buying into marketing hype, but it makes no sense.

I'm glad people find joy in Pearl Jam. It doesn't make me sick to hear those opinions, but I can't agree with the last 3 albums being "truly creative."