Red Mosquito

Simple Torture wrote:I don't think someone's case should be made on some isolated stat alone (especially batting average), but Rolen is still fringe for me. I guess the case is made looking at his long-term consistency and the fact that he was a solid player in the steroid era who never had that stink on him.

which, of course, no one can say for certain whether he did or didn't

blueviper wrote:He's probably in for more defense.

I think as the years go on you'll see an adjustment on how players are rated in terms of hall of fame worthiness. Are careers trending shorter? Will rules changes (like this coming years pitch clock and no infield shifts) affect player stats?

Yeah, in general I don't think defense is valued nearly enough, especially at non-up-the-middle positions. Rolen is easily one of the best defensive players of all time, and his 122 wRC+ is tied with Kirby Puckett and Paul Molitor.

Rolen was always a no-brainer for me, but I'm still a bit surprised he got in.

the fact that baseball writers are judging other's morals isnt the least bit concerning

If the voting consensus really favored defense I’m glad, but he is still fringe to me. It will all be okay though.

lennytheweedwhacker wrote:If the voting consensus really favored defense I’m glad, but he is still fringe to me. It will all be okay though.

It's better than being cringe

I don’t know what Fred McGriff’s stats are he just feels like someone who should be in, to me anyway.

Probably because the Braves were on TBS every day in the ‘90s.

I guess being a rockie hurts Todd Helton...loved watching him play back in the day

doug rr wrote:I guess being a rockie hurts Todd Helton...loved watching him play back in the day

More so a Tennessee Vol

philpritchard wrote:

blueviper wrote:He's probably in for more defense.

I think as the years go on you'll see an adjustment on how players are rated in terms of hall of fame worthiness. Are careers trending shorter? Will rules changes (like this coming years pitch clock and no infield shifts) affect player stats?

Yeah, in general I don't think defense is valued nearly enough, especially at non-up-the-middle positions. Rolen is easily one of the best defensive players of all time, and his 122 wRC+ is tied with Kirby Puckett and Paul Molitor.

Rolen was always a no-brainer for me, but I'm still a bit surprised he got in.

what are you feelings on omar vizquel?

My gut is yes for Omar. Defense aside he almost had 3,000 hits, was a good base stealer in his prime. I think the issue with his candidacy is there were so many offensive SS stars in his era.

Roberto Luongo doesn't deserve this. What a pile a shit.

Mark Grace

Nah.

Kyle Seager

He should go in twice.

Bammer wrote:Mark Grace

he introduced the non sports playing public to slump busters...

Barry Bonds prior to arriving in San Fran

Bammer wrote:Barry Bonds prior to arriving in San Fran

Based on his stats there alone - no way.

lennytheweedwhacker wrote:

Bammer wrote:Barry Bonds prior to arriving in San Fran

Based on his stats there alone - no way.

I can't imagine a hypothetical baseball player that I'd consider a HOFer after just 7 seasons.

That being said--in his last 4 seasons in PIT, he had 8+ bWAR each season and 2 MVPs. He became a HOFer in Pittsburgh, but he hadn't amassed the length of resume just yet.

Simple Torture wrote:

lennytheweedwhacker wrote:

Bammer wrote:Barry Bonds prior to arriving in San Fran

Based on his stats there alone - no way.

I can't imagine a hypothetical baseball player that I'd consider a HOFer after just 7 seasons.

That being said--in his last 4 seasons in PIT, he had 8+ bWAR each season and 2 MVPs. He became a HOFer in Pittsburgh, but he hadn't amassed the length of resume just yet.

Oh yeah I definitely agree with that.