Red Mosquito

I loved the first JJ Star Trek movie, but the second was just...a reboot of Wrath. It was as flawed as TFA but without the charm of this one.

I liked the first one, but thought it was partly ruined by the bad time travel story. The second is among my top 100 movies of the decade.

I actually liked that idea of a different timeline. It was very smart to have that and still have the old movies.

100 movies of the decade? wow you are a fan.

Time travel stories are one of the things I very seldom like. Although it’s different for Dr. Who where it’s the whole concept.

A reboot I have no problem with.

Can we all agree that Kathleen Kennedy should be shot out of a fucking cannon on January 1st 2020 for all Star Wars fans to see?

lowlight79 wrote:Can we all agree that Kathleen Kennedy should be shot out of a fucking cannon on January 1st 2020 for all Star Wars fans to see?

That seems a bit hyperbolic.


This, and the outrage against Kathleen Kennedy seems a bit unwarranted. Everyone knows my displeasure with the ST but I can't place the blame on Kennedy. Check out her CV on wikipedia. She's more than earned her position at Lucasfilm. Now, people pissed about TLJ and TROS want to burn her at the stake.

Weird.

and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

blueviper wrote:and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

The more I think about it, the more it comes down to this: The end of The Last Jedi set up a movie that had to figure out creative and interesting ways to deal with the dangling plot threads. Kylo Ren is beyond redemption; he is not Anakin Skywalker, he is now effectively the Big Bad, he has smashed his helmet after realizing that he only wears it to emulate Darth Vader, and he is not Darth Vader. The Force is a thing that you don't need to have "special blood" to tap into; it's this universal life force that anyone can access, and Rey is just a regular person who is sensitive to it. The war is more than just evil space wizards versus good space wizards; it is a consequence of avarice and greed of the ruling class, and the folk legend of the Jedi and the resistance will encourage the oppressed to rise above their station and fight.

In TROS: No, actually, Kylo Ren is the redeemable Darth Vader facsimile, he has superglued his mask back together, and also he isn't the Big Bad anymore because we are bringing the old Big Bad back, and also Rey isn't a nobody, she also has special blood! Which you need to be super powerful in the force. And we are going to again focus on evil space wizards versus good space wizards, and did we mention the Emperor is back?! That's cool, right?

TLJ feels like an infinitely more interesting, personal story in light of TROS's fanboy pandering

blueviper wrote:and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

I'm not saying it's an easy job at LF, but she got a pass with the first film being basically ANH remake. I enjoyed TLJ alot, my only issue is maybe there needed to be some stuff cut, I believe putting Luke in the first film would of maybe eased, but not help the reaction to Luke in TLJ, but people either liked it or hated it. TROS while in my previous post I stated had some amazing moments, I did like the film, but the entire film feels rushed; and the fact they just put story aside for the sake of making a fun film wasn't the way I wanted to see it end. They should of never stuck to putting that movie out in 2019. They needed more time, but Disney is a machine, scheduling movies out 3 or 4 years now. Don't get me wrong, Disney has done some amazing stuff, but they are monopolizing the film industry.

lowlight79 wrote:

blueviper wrote:and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

I'm not saying it's an easy job at LF, but she got a pass with the first film being basically ANH remake. I enjoyed TLJ alot, my only issue is maybe there needed to be some stuff cut, I believe putting Luke in the first film would of maybe eased, but not help the reaction to Luke in TLJ, but people either liked it or hated it. TROS while in my previous post I stated had some amazing moments, I did like the film, but the entire film feels rushed; and the fact they just put story aside for the sake of making a fun film wasn't the way I wanted to see it end. They should of never stuck to putting that movie out in 2019. They needed more time, but Disney is a machine, scheduling movies out 3 or 4 years now. Don't get me wrong, Disney has done some amazing stuff, but they are monopolizing the film industry.

True. Just look at the release schedule. 2 years between movies instead of the 3 years that the OT and PT had.

When you have a 3rd death star (in TFA) and then death star star destroyers (in TROS), then something is really wrong with your story idea meetings at LFL.

blueviper wrote:

lowlight79 wrote:

blueviper wrote:and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

I'm not saying it's an easy job at LF, but she got a pass with the first film being basically ANH remake. I enjoyed TLJ alot, my only issue is maybe there needed to be some stuff cut, I believe putting Luke in the first film would of maybe eased, but not help the reaction to Luke in TLJ, but people either liked it or hated it. TROS while in my previous post I stated had some amazing moments, I did like the film, but the entire film feels rushed; and the fact they just put story aside for the sake of making a fun film wasn't the way I wanted to see it end. They should of never stuck to putting that movie out in 2019. They needed more time, but Disney is a machine, scheduling movies out 3 or 4 years now. Don't get me wrong, Disney has done some amazing stuff, but they are monopolizing the film industry.

True. Just look at the release schedule. 2 years between movies instead of the 3 years that the OT and PT had.

When you have a 3rd death star (in TFA) and then death star star destroyers (in TROS), then something is really wrong with your story idea meetings at LFL.

Lucas: Were gonna make him a kid.

JJ: We need more Death Star like things!

Well, im not sure its Kennedy´s fault but they had their issues for sure. They fired directors, tossed out scripts, reshooted movies.

Did you all miss Finn being force sensitive in this? You seem to have.

It didn’t just awaken in him it awakened in Jannah and her squad when they wouldn’t carry out the killing.

That’s the carry through from tlj of the force being in all of us to varying degrees of capability.

Weird people seem to have missed that

dimejinky99 wrote:Did you all miss Finn being force sensitive in this? You seem to have.

It didn’t just awaken in him it awakened in Jannah and her squad when they wouldn’t carry out the killing.

That’s the carry through from tlj of the force being in all of us to varying degrees of capability.

Weird people seem to have missed that

That’s not how the force works

dimejinky99 wrote:Did you all miss Finn being force sensitive in this? You seem to have.

It didn’t just awaken in him it awakened in Jannah and her squad when they wouldn’t carry out the killing.

That’s the carry through from tlj of the force being in all of us to varying degrees of capability.

Weird people seem to have missed that

I didnt miss it. Finn being force sensitive is something JJ also hinted in TFA. But its just a hint, here its a little more explicit but not talked about.
Im ok with how its handled here.

dimejinky99 wrote:Did you all miss Finn being force sensitive in this? You seem to have.

Nope. Didn’t miss it.

dimejinky99 wrote: It didn’t just awaken in him it awakened in Jannah and her squad when they wouldn’t carry out the killing.

Nope. That did not happen.

dimejinky99 wrote: That’s the carry through from tlj of the force being in all of us to varying degrees of capability.

Sure. Especially if you’re a Palpatine.

dimejinky99 wrote: Weird people seem to have missed that

Nope

dimejinky99 wrote:Did you all miss Finn being force sensitive in this? You seem to have.

It didn’t just awaken in him it awakened in Jannah and her squad when they wouldn’t carry out the killing.

That’s the carry through from tlj of the force being in all of us to varying degrees of capability.

Weird people seem to have missed that

I did kind of miss it, and I only really realized that the secret he was supposed to tell Rey was that he was force-sensitive until after reading post-release interviews, and it seems like that's the case for most people, and I think that indicates that it was not conveyed very effectively.

It also means that as an idea it went from a major thematic element to a barely-there, easily-missable thing

theplatypus wrote:

blueviper wrote:and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

The more I think about it, the more it comes down to this: The end of The Last Jedi set up a movie that had to figure out creative and interesting ways to deal with the dangling plot threads. Kylo Ren is beyond redemption; he is not Anakin Skywalker, he is now effectively the Big Bad, he has smashed his helmet after realizing that he only wears it to emulate Darth Vader, and he is not Darth Vader. The Force is a thing that you don't need to have "special blood" to tap into; it's this universal life force that anyone can access, and Rey is just a regular person who is sensitive to it. The war is more than just evil space wizards versus good space wizards; it is a consequence of avarice and greed of the ruling class, and the folk legend of the Jedi and the resistance will encourage the oppressed to rise above their station and fight.

In TROS: No, actually, Kylo Ren is the redeemable Darth Vader facsimile, he has superglued his mask back together, and also he isn't the Big Bad anymore because we are bringing the old Big Bad back, and also Rey isn't a nobody, she also has special blood! Which you need to be super powerful in the force. And we are going to again focus on evil space wizards versus good space wizards, and did we mention the Emperor is back?! That's cool, right?

TLJ feels like an infinitely more interesting, personal story in light of TROS's fanboy pandering

Wow. He’s not wrong.

‘ “Kylo literally caused the deaths of the entire original Star Wars trilogy trio.”

theplatypus wrote:

blueviper wrote:and I don't think there are really any jabs taken in TROS against TLJ.

Luke catching the saber? At the end of TLJ he's already decided that he was probably wrong about everything beforehand and does come back to help out. It's like he realized his mistake. The saber catch just solidifies it.

Rose not being used? Maybe, but there are so many speaking roles created in the past few films that they all can't get equal screen time.


Am I, in a round about way, defending TLJ? Dear lord...

The more I think about it, the more it comes down to this: The end of The Last Jedi set up a movie that had to figure out creative and interesting ways to deal with the dangling plot threads. Kylo Ren is beyond redemption; he is not Anakin Skywalker, he is now effectively the Big Bad, he has smashed his helmet after realizing that he only wears it to emulate Darth Vader, and he is not Darth Vader. The Force is a thing that you don't need to have "special blood" to tap into; it's this universal life force that anyone can access, and Rey is just a regular person who is sensitive to it. The war is more than just evil space wizards versus good space wizards; it is a consequence of avarice and greed of the ruling class, and the folk legend of the Jedi and the resistance will encourage the oppressed to rise above their station and fight.

In TROS: No, actually, Kylo Ren is the redeemable Darth Vader facsimile, he has superglued his mask back together, and also he isn't the Big Bad anymore because we are bringing the old Big Bad back, and also Rey isn't a nobody, she also has special blood! Which you need to be super powerful in the force. And we are going to again focus on evil space wizards versus good space wizards, and did we mention the Emperor is back?! That's cool, right?

TLJ feels like an infinitely more interesting, personal story in light of TROS's fanboy pandering

Nicely put. I completely agree with most of this!