Star Wars: Episode VII: The Force Awakens (2015)

[LoathedVermin72]

they're clearly not just aimed at kids (witness this thread). They are aimed at a innocent and a sense of unencumbered wonder, which is something we associate with childhood only because life hasn't beaten it out of you at that point. But there's something powerful about that feeling, which is why adults look for ways to recapture it.

Except this movie doesn't have that at all.

I think that most of the world's reaction to this film probably begs to differ.

Great argument

I think it is a better argument than the narcissistic assumption that because I failed to experience something therefore the experience must not exist.

A genuine "sense of wonder" is always going to be totally subjective, even if we start getting into specific aesthetic choices, such as camera angles and whatnot. But I really don't see where there that sensibility comes through in the material, disregarding visceral reactions.

LV, you remind me of one of my good friends who studied film in college. he's often so preoccupied with proper crane shots, etc. that he can't enjoy a movie like a normal person anymore. it happens, it's understandable, but just be aware of it.

I'm not fixated on technical minutiae, but I am concerned with the ideological and aesthetic fabric of a movie, as I would be with any work of art. That doesn't mean I don't enjoy watching movies. On the contrary - few things are more thrilling than watching a truly great movie.

[lennytheweedwhacker]

Guesses for Opening Weekend US Domestic Gross:

strat - $2.5 b
ruddo - $325 m
CopperTom - $350 m
Kaius - $278 m
spike - $251 m
zeb - $250 m
Simple Torture - $245 m
lenny - $236 m
Argo - $230 m
stip - $211 m
Burt - $1 m

Update on this: it's estimated that TFA grossed $120 million domestically on Thursday/Friday, which breaks two records: largest Thursday-preview opening ever ($57 m) and largest one-day total ever ($120 m--keep in mind that for record keeping purposes, "one day" includes Thursday and Friday). Also keep in mind that these are estimates, and that these totals usually go up. Target to break the largest opening weekend ever is $208.8 m (Jurassic World). If I got another guess, I'd probably put it in Kaius' guess territory.

Lenny takes it: $238 million.

http://variety.com/2015/film/box-office ... 201665753/

my people are contacting daisy ridley's people as we speak

[spike]

they're clearly not just aimed at kids (witness this thread). They are aimed at a innocent and a sense of unencumbered wonder, which is something we associate with childhood only because life hasn't beaten it out of you at that point. But there's something powerful about that feeling, which is why adults look for ways to recapture it.

Except this movie doesn't have that at all.

I think that most of the world's reaction to this film probably begs to differ.

Great argument

I think it is a better argument than the narcissistic assumption that because I failed to experience something therefore the experience must not exist.

A genuine "sense of wonder" is always going to be totally subjective, even if we start getting into specific aesthetic choices, such as camera angles and whatnot. But I really don't see where there that sensibility comes through in the material, disregarding visceral reactions.

LV, you remind me of one of my good friends who studied film in college. he's often so preoccupied with proper crane shots, etc. that he can't enjoy a movie like a normal person anymore. it happens, it's understandable, but just be aware of it.

I'm not fixated on technical minutiae, but I am concerned with the ideological and aesthetic fabric of a movie, as I would be with any work of art. That doesn't mean I don't enjoy watching movies. On the contrary - few things are more thrilling than watching a truly great movie.

qed

[@SkitchP]

Damned yanks thinking there's no world outside their borders haha

This was random

Not really. Because god forbid we, as americans, rate american made movies by the box office here in america so that they can be compared to movies that were historically released in america.

[stip]

they're clearly not just aimed at kids (witness this thread). They are aimed at a innocent and a sense of unencumbered wonder, which is something we associate with childhood only because life hasn't beaten it out of you at that point. But there's something powerful about that feeling, which is why adults look for ways to recapture it.

Except this movie doesn't have that at all.

I think that most of the world's reaction to this film probably begs to differ.

Great argument

I think it is a better argument than the narcissistic assumption that because I failed to experience something therefore the experience must not exist.

A genuine "sense of wonder" is always going to be totally subjective, even if we start getting into specific aesthetic choices, such as camera angles and whatnot. But I really don't see where there that sensibility comes through in the material, disregarding visceral reactions.

If it is totally subjective then how can you disregard the visceral experience. That becomes the measure. As far as how it comes through in the material, there is 50 pages in this forum and thousands on the internet where people are laying out precisely when and where and how and why they were affected, to which your response again is 'I don't see it, so it doesn't exist.'

Thousands of clueless fanboys jizzing themselves over "NEW SW THAT'S NOSTALGIC AND NOT LIKE THE PREQUELS OMG I'M CRYING" hardly qualifies as compelling evidence of what the movie is doing. In the end, if we're dealing in subjective, emotional responses, your visceral reaction is no more valid than my lack of one, even if a lot of people agree with you. We would need to break this down to the ideology of the film itself, and just saying shit like "Oh man thing X was great" or "the new characters really worked" isn't enough.

No individual reaciton is more valid than the other, but if we're going to ask whether or not the film succeeded in establishing that feeling then the reactions of everyone do matter. And the two hundred million dollars this movie will make and the overwhelmingly positive reviews (from reviewers falling over themselves to not get prequel sucker punched) does mean that it has struck a chord. The only way to measure the widespread reach of a subjective experience is by seeing how wide spread it is, and trying to understand what helped it reach the people it did.


And there are a lot of things we've been talking about. The iconic sounds and images are obviously powerful, as is the way that the story managed to utilize existing attachments to established characters in ways that felt earned and authentic (witness almost every reaction to Han Solo, and compare this to the groaning way OT stuff was shoehorned into the prequels--simply seeing the characters is not enough--it has to feel organic). It creates the direct pipeline to the wellspring of good will and attachment that we have to the OT, and the innocent escapism and the way it fired our imaginations.

But this is more than just seeing these things again. The movie expertly captured the tone and the values of the original trilogy. It's light--even the darker moments never feel oppressive (compare the duel in the forest, which was intense but never stuffy, warm despite the snow to something like Man of Steel which weighs down heavily on you even when that's not the intention). Even when it has its darker moments it never feels cynical or abandons the fundamental faith that animates the movies--that there is good in the darkest places and that people can be counted on to stand and do the right thing.

There is also an incredible sense of comradire and companionship in the OT (probably what was most sorely lacking in the prequels) --that everyone is incredibly likeable, warts and all, and that they will welcome you into their family and their journey. And that's one of the places where the new cast (and Abrams direction and I guess the screenplay as the glue between them) really excelled. It's not just that we've been given a bunch of familiar characters and sounds and images. We were given a story that never loses sight of its simple good has the power to heal and redeem message and were given characters who we not only want to root for, but can identify with in ways that allow us, as the audience to use them as surrogates for us. And not as wish fulfillment (isn't this guy a bad ass--I wish I was a bad ass too) but as people we can relate to because we see ourselves in them.


I haven't seen the movie enough (just once) to go shot by shot with this stuff, but that's what the people who like this film are seeing. To dismiss it as fan boy salivating is an intellectually dishonest way of waving way something you can't understand.

You don't have to agree with it, mind you. But you can understand the impact something has without experiencing it yourself.

[Chris_H_2]

Damned yanks thinking there's no world outside their borders haha

This was random

Not really. Because god forbid we, as americans, rate american made movies by the box office here in america so that they can be compared to movies that were historically released in america.

I was just thinking more within the context of this thread.

[stip]

Finns number is FN2187

The cell Leia is held in A new hope?

2187

I like fun little moments like that.

I totally missed it, though

[stip]

they're clearly not just aimed at kids (witness this thread). They are aimed at a innocent and a sense of unencumbered wonder, which is something we associate with childhood only because life hasn't beaten it out of you at that point. But there's something powerful about that feeling, which is why adults look for ways to recapture it.

Except this movie doesn't have that at all.

I think that most of the world's reaction to this film probably begs to differ.

Great argument

I think it is a better argument than the narcissistic assumption that because I failed to experience something therefore the experience must not exist.

A genuine "sense of wonder" is always going to be totally subjective, even if we start getting into specific aesthetic choices, such as camera angles and whatnot. But I really don't see where there that sensibility comes through in the material, disregarding visceral reactions.

LV, you remind me of one of my good friends who studied film in college. he's often so preoccupied with proper crane shots, etc. that he can't enjoy a movie like a normal person anymore. it happens, it's understandable, but just be aware of it.

LV hasn't actually made much of an argument beyond stating things he doesn't like, plus something about how millennials talk.

[stip]

What is your ideological objection to Force Awakens?

[@SkitchP]

Damned yanks thinking there's no world outside their borders haha

This was random

Not really. Because god forbid we, as americans, rate american made movies by the box office here in america so that they can be compared to movies that were historically released in america.

I was just thinking more within the context of this thread.

Have you ever discussed anything with dime before? are you new here?

[stip]

wow, only 8 million dollars behind Jurassic World without a china opening.

I wonder how much Jurassic world did in china its opening weekend.

[stip]

also, how can they release this number at 1:20 est on Sunday?

[spike]

they're clearly not just aimed at kids (witness this thread). They are aimed at a innocent and a sense of unencumbered wonder, which is something we associate with childhood only because life hasn't beaten it out of you at that point. But there's something powerful about that feeling, which is why adults look for ways to recapture it.

Except this movie doesn't have that at all.

I think that most of the world's reaction to this film probably begs to differ.

Great argument

I think it is a better argument than the narcissistic assumption that because I failed to experience something therefore the experience must not exist.

A genuine "sense of wonder" is always going to be totally subjective, even if we start getting into specific aesthetic choices, such as camera angles and whatnot. But I really don't see where there that sensibility comes through in the material, disregarding visceral reactions.

LV, you remind me of one of my good friends who studied film in college. he's often so preoccupied with proper crane shots, etc. that he can't enjoy a movie like a normal person anymore. it happens, it's understandable, but just be aware of it.

LV hasn't actually made much of an argument beyond stating things he doesn't like, plus something about how millennials talk.

i'm not just considering what's happened in this thread; i've been observing him for awhile.

[spike]

also, how can they release this number at 1:20 est on Sunday?

the same way they can call election winners, stip.

[stip]

Fair enough. Most of the time when I try to engage him he just says he's talked about something before and doesn't want to do it again

[stip]

Of course it could just be me

[stip]

It's probably me

[stip]

yeah but they don't release popular vote totals.

[@SkitchP]

also, how can they release this number at 1:20 est on Sunday?

the same way they can call election winners, stip.

Are you claiming GWB was strong in the force?

[stip]

shit, do they? This is something I should know.