Red Mosquito

I thought for sure they were gonna hint there were still dead up there. Like the cycle begins again crap.

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:Jon murdered a queen in cold blood. There were allies of Dany in that council meeting to determine the next king. There has to be some sort of punishment to appease them and to have justice.

I wouldn't call that a cold blood murder. He prevented a tyrant from killing all the people in Westeros then is banished for it.

She wasn't going to kill everyone.

Tryion, Sansa, and Arya, and pretty much the entire north would have been on her hit list.

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:Jon murdered a queen in cold blood. There were allies of Dany in that council meeting to determine the next king. There has to be some sort of punishment to appease them and to have justice.

I wouldn't call that a cold blood murder. He prevented a tyrant from killing all the people in Westeros then is banished for it.

She wasn't going to kill everyone.

Tryion, Sansa, and Arya, and pretty much the entire north would have been on her hit list.

Not everyone though.

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

Yup. Again this is what has been wrong this season. Weak storytelling. Glossed over. Rushed. Not fleshed out. I don’t hate the story choices - just how they get there.

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:Jon murdered a queen in cold blood. There were allies of Dany in that council meeting to determine the next king. There has to be some sort of punishment to appease them and to have justice.

I wouldn't call that a cold blood murder. He prevented a tyrant from killing all the people in Westeros then is banished for it.

She wasn't going to kill everyone.

Tryion, Sansa, and Arya, and pretty much the entire north would have been on her hit list.

Not everyone though.

The point is she would destroy anyone who doesn’t bend the knee to her. A tyrant like those before her. She was no different and that is exactly what her campaign for president was about.

It’s amazing to me that people are still judging this story based on fantasy tropes that it has always set out to contrast.

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:Jon murdered a queen in cold blood. There were allies of Dany in that council meeting to determine the next king. There has to be some sort of punishment to appease them and to have justice.

I wouldn't call that a cold blood murder. He prevented a tyrant from killing all the people in Westeros then is banished for it.

She wasn't going to kill everyone.

Tryion, Sansa, and Arya, and pretty much the entire north would have been on her hit list.

Not everyone though.

Yeah, just 75% of them

Strat wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:Jon murdered a queen in cold blood. There were allies of Dany in that council meeting to determine the next king. There has to be some sort of punishment to appease them and to have justice.

I wouldn't call that a cold blood murder. He prevented a tyrant from killing all the people in Westeros then is banished for it.

She wasn't going to kill everyone.

Tryion, Sansa, and Arya, and pretty much the entire north would have been on her hit list.

Not everyone though.

The point is she would destroy anyone who doesn’t bend the knee to her. A tyrant like those before her. She was no different and that is exactly what her campaign for president was about.

Right, but raising Jon up to the throne would ignore her allies that still remain (Dorne, Iron Islands, etc.).

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The show is pretty clear that love is a weakness. So, sending Jon to "the only place he had found love" is a bit of a mixed message at best, and a curse at worst.

The best (and to my mind only satisfying) ending to Jon Snow was death. And yet going into this episode, I knew he would not die. That was clear and therefore, I was totally prepared for an unsatisfying ending to his story. It wasn't too big a pill to swallow for me.

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Monkey_Driven wrote:Jon murdered a queen in cold blood. There were allies of Dany in that council meeting to determine the next king. There has to be some sort of punishment to appease them and to have justice.

I wouldn't call that a cold blood murder. He prevented a tyrant from killing all the people in Westeros then is banished for it.

She wasn't going to kill everyone.

Tryion, Sansa, and Arya, and pretty much the entire north would have been on her hit list.

Not everyone though.

Yeah, just 75% of them

The population of the North was small to begin with, but even smaller after all the battles.

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

I get that, and regardless of bloodlines, Jon should have been under consideration. He brings people together, is a natural leader, and a war hero. Additionally, he has the name.

I was just happy to see his flowing locks flapping in the cold winds of the north again. None of the samurai pony crap.

darth_vedder wrote:

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

I get that, and regardless of bloodlines, Jon should have been under consideration. He brings people together, is a natural leader, and a war hero. Additionally, he has the name.

he still murdered someone

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

I get that, and regardless of bloodlines, Jon should have been under consideration. He brings people together, is a natural leader, and a war hero. Additionally, he has the name.

he still murdered someone

So did pretty much everyone else, yet they are rewarded. Bronn gets Highgarden, Tyrion is Hand again, they are both murderers.

darth_vedder wrote:

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

I get that, and regardless of bloodlines, Jon should have been under consideration. He brings people together, is a natural leader, and a war hero. Additionally, he has the name.

"Daenerys Targaryen murdered scores of thousands of innocent people to try and take the throne, and we have come up with a new system to put leaders on the throne that the people can trust. Please welcome your new king...Aegon Targaryen."

Simple Torture wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

I get that, and regardless of bloodlines, Jon should have been under consideration. He brings people together, is a natural leader, and a war hero. Additionally, he has the name.

"Daenerys Targaryen murdered scores of thousands of innocent people to try and take the throne, and we have come up with a new system to put leaders on the throne that the people can trust. Please welcome your new king...Aegon Targaryen."

AL

Simple Torture wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

I get that, and regardless of bloodlines, Jon should have been under consideration. He brings people together, is a natural leader, and a war hero. Additionally, he has the name.

"Daenerys Targaryen murdered scores of thousands of innocent people to try and take the throne, and we have come up with a new system to put leaders on the throne that the people can trust. Please welcome your new king...Aegon Targaryen."

Yep, regardless of name / bloodlines, Jon would have been a good candidate. He then politely refuses, and goes north (not because he was banished).

Mecca wrote:

darth_vedder wrote:

Bi_3 wrote:

bada wrote:Didn't Jon end up right where he would have wanted anyway? If he could have chosen? Doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.

He ended up where he had been happiest, the only place he had found love, so yeah I don't see it as too bad. It's a wonderful parallel with Ned's original choice as well.

I didn't mind any of that. Just the way that council glossed over the fact that he is the true heir... I think he should have been presented with the option of king then turn it down and go north. It was close, but I felt like after all the work he did that they just left him out to dry and moved on without him.

The conclusion of that council was that merit is a better form of choosing a ruler than bloodlines

And that is one of the things that felt so wrong about that scene. Everyone there is there because of bloodlines, likely with a lot of unhappy peasants back home, they are just going to flip to some kind of electoral system just like that and not think that they are going to get the same treatment applied to them and their families? At least Sam should remember what democracy lead to at the Wall when Jon got elected.