Red Mosquito

Hello! I'm new to this site, and Pearl Jam have been a recent obsession of mine (ie, I've only become a huge fan over the last two years). Interestingly, I've been reading here that some people have been turned on to Glen Hansard/The Frames through Eddie and PJ - well, for me it was the other way round.

I've been a HUGE Frames fan for as long as I can remember, and it was through a Frames forum that somebody suggested I check out some PJ. In fact, if anyone has been taken with Glen on the recent tour, and wants recommendation on what albums/songs to check out - I'll be happy to help.

That, followed by watching PJ20, and I was sold on Pearl Jam. I know some of you have been to, like, a zillion concerts, and have been Ten Club members since 1864 - but hey, I guess I'm recent, but no less obsessive convert!

For me, the only artists who inspire me as much as PJ are The Frames (and most things Glen Hansard touches), Ryan Adams and Ani Difranco. I've been to no less than 18 Ryan concerts, 6 Glen, and over 20 Ani D. HOWEVER - as of now, I've only had the chance to see EV solo in London last year - and it was incredible. Such a great fan community - I've never seen anything like it. You can't help but be swept up in it! Can't wait for my first Pearl Jam show!!

So, I thought I'd share something with you, as a way of sparking discussion, as well as introducing myself.

First of all, I've spent most of the last 6 months listening constantly to all the studio stuff, and finding where my heart lies in the PJ collection. Here's my top ten:

1. Vs
2. Vitalogy
3. Ten
4. No Code

(then, for me there is quite a considerable drop in quality - ie, all of the above are masterpieces for me. The below are great, but not timeless)

5. Backspacer
6. Yield

(again, another drop in quality here)

7. Riot Act
8. Binaural

(and at the bottom - sorry, but I really find this album very difficult to love...)

9. Pearl Jam

So anyways, here's my theory, and it concerns RADIOHEAD!!

For me, I can compare the first 4 Radiohead albums with the first 4 PJ albums, as they follow a similar pattern.

1. Ten/Pablo Honey

Both sound a little dated nowadays - both very 90's - but still rock pretty hard, in a way that either band hasn't really all-out rocked since. They both have the "one big single" that catapulted them to fame (Alive/Creep). They both concern outcast characters and owe a debt to the Pixies. They both feel like naive first steps of a Rock n Roll band, not yet fully formed.

2. Vs/The Bends

Both sound like a band much more confident about themselves. Bigger highs, bigger lows, and much higher quality songwriting. Both bands begin to shun the spotlight, even as they are at their commercial peak. The both contain anthemic acoustic numbers (Small Town/Fake Plastic Trees) as well as full on agression (Blood/My Iron Lung). Both feel like world conquering stadium rock albums.

3. Vitalogy/Ok Computer

The experimental one, but the one where the bands are still basically sticking to their routes - albeit reaching for something greater than the sum of their parts. Both have weird "non-songs" (Pry To/Fitter Happier). Both are arguably fan favourites as well as being critically acclaimed. They'd done the debut, then the more confident follow up, and were now ready to think outside the box a little bit. Both are also, for me at least, two of the greatest records of all time.

4. No Code/Kid A

Now, clearly, Radiohead go much further with their experimentation than PJ do here, but having taken tentative steps away from stadium rock with their previous albums, both show little or no interest in it here. No Code is completely PJ's Kid A for me. Bold, varied, sad, beautiful, flawed, and most importantly - adventurous. The title - No Code is perfect - no rules - lets just jam and see what comes.

The problem from this point for me and Pearl Jam, is I wish they would have continued the avant garde type direction they were going in. Instead they opted to play it safe with Yield, which for me is a backwards step of an album. Obviously, they've made some gorgeous music since No Code - but I can't help but want them to push the envelope a little more! I know they're not Radiohead stylistically, and I wouldn't want them to be (I much prefer PJ anyway). But I would LOVE the next record to be more like No Code - or at the very least - to explore new territory.

So that's me.

Oh, and I'm Sam, and I'm from London, Uk. Hi!

You have done your homework, I like your comparisons. Welcome to the board

Youkan

Great post!

samiad wrote:The problem from this point for me and Pearl Jam, is I wish they would have continued the avant garde type direction they were going in. Instead they opted to play it safe with Yield, which for me is a backwards step of an album. Obviously, they've made some gorgeous music since No Code - but I can't help but want them to push the envelope a little more! I know they're not Radiohead stylistically, and I wouldn't want them to be (I much prefer PJ anyway). But I would LOVE the next record to be more like No Code - or at the very least - to explore new territory.

Very much agreed with this.

Birds in Hell wrote:Great post!

samiad wrote:The problem from this point for me and Pearl Jam, is I wish they would have continued the avant garde type direction they were going in. Instead they opted to play it safe with Yield, which for me is a backwards step of an album. Obviously, they've made some gorgeous music since No Code - but I can't help but want them to push the envelope a little more! I know they're not Radiohead stylistically, and I wouldn't want them to be (I much prefer PJ anyway). But I would LOVE the next record to be more like No Code - or at the very least - to explore new territory.

Very much agreed with this.

I agree with the sentiment but I think Yield was part of that progression that I liked. I don't sense a huge deviation from it until post Riot Act.

I guess in hindsight the first real red flag was pussying out of letting Tchad Blake have his way with Binaural.

I like Yield an awful lot, certainly more than any of the records that followed, but I do think it's a more conservative album than Vitalogy and No Code.

Birds in Hell wrote:I like Yield an awful lot, certainly more than any of the records that followed, but I do think it's a more conservative album than Vitalogy and No Code.

I won't argue with that. But I also don't see it as a regression or even stagnation in the way that Self Titled and Backspacer can be seen.

Birds in Hell wrote:I like Yield an awful lot, certainly more than any of the records that followed, but I do think it's a more conservative album than Vitalogy and No Code.

I don't know if conservative is the right word but this album does have less interesting little twists and turns. Sometimes it's nice to just bash it out with straighter rock arrangements if you've spent a lot of time agonizing over the previous batch of songs you've worked on. I think that's where Yield works well. It doesn't get overly bogged down with it's own seriousness like some of those previous records.

Fuzzcharger wrote:

Birds in Hell wrote:I like Yield an awful lot, certainly more than any of the records that followed, but I do think it's a more conservative album than Vitalogy and No Code.

I don't know if conservative is the right word but this album does have less interesting little twists and turns. Sometimes it's nice to just bash it out with straighter rock arrangements if you've spent a lot of time agonizing over the previous batch of songs you've worked on. I think that's where Yield works well. It doesn't get overly bogged down with it's own seriousness like some of those previous records.

Oh, for sure. The "mindless good time" music Jack Irons refers to in SVT.

All I mean is that I understand what the OP means (unless I'm misunderstanding them); anthemic choruses like those of Given to Fly and In Hiding are something the band had more or less set aside on the previous two records, so in a sense there was some level of regression (as opposed to the steady progression to that point.) I still love the album.

Birds in Hell wrote:All I mean is that I understand what the OP means (unless I'm misunderstanding them); anthemic choruses like those of Given to Fly and In Hiding are something the band had more or less set aside on the previous two records, so in a sense there was some level of regression (as opposed to the steady progression to that point.) I still love the album.

I hear ya. I wonder where the next logical direction would be for a rock band once they've done the anthemic choruses thing and the more experimental non-chorusy songs thing. I think a degree of regression is inevitable but after a few records it's probably more to do with revisiting and further developing previously explored musical ideas than getting musically worse as regression might suggest.

Aside from obviously going and making a techno record as a next logical progression of course.

Agreed. I think there's probably a finite amount of sounds and styles one particular group of musicians are going to excel at, after a certain point (if still playing together) it's eventually going to lead to revision and refinement of what they've done before. I don't have any particular problem with that, especially if it's a return to something I enjoyed the first time around - hence why the OP and I long for a return to a No Code-esque approach while stip's often pleased whenever they indulge their soaring, anthemic sensibilities.

I think we've just come full circle.

Time, don't let it slip away.

I don't know if I'd call Yield as 'experimental' as the previously two records, but I definitely wouldn't call it a step backwards in any way. I'd call stuff like Evolution as off-the-map for PJ as anything on the previous two records. That being said, I think it doesn't wear it's experimentation on it's sleeve the way Vitalogy and No Code does, particularly the former record.

That being said, I think the correlation between PJ's records and Radiohead, at least in terms of their career if not the breadth of experimentation that happens from record to record, is a pretty strong comparison. Personally, I'd view Ten in a much better light than Pablo Honey, though.

digster wrote:I don't know if I'd call Yield as 'experimental' as the previously two records, but I definitely wouldn't call it a step backwards in any way. I'd call stuff like Evolution as off-the-map for PJ as anything on the previous two records. That being said, I think it doesn't wear it's experimentation on it's sleeve the way Vitalogy and No Code does, particularly the former record.

That being said, I think the correlation between PJ's records and Radiohead, at least in terms of their career if not the breadth of experimentation that happens from record to record, is a pretty strong comparison. Personally, I'd view Ten in a much better light than Pablo Honey, though.

I don't think anyone actually said Yield was experimental. Quite the opposite infact.

Fuzzcharger wrote:

digster wrote:I don't know if I'd call Yield as 'experimental' as the previously two records, but I definitely wouldn't call it a step backwards in any way. I'd call stuff like Evolution as off-the-map for PJ as anything on the previous two records. That being said, I think it doesn't wear it's experimentation on it's sleeve the way Vitalogy and No Code does, particularly the former record.

That being said, I think the correlation between PJ's records and Radiohead, at least in terms of their career if not the breadth of experimentation that happens from record to record, is a pretty strong comparison. Personally, I'd view Ten in a much better light than Pablo Honey, though.

I don't think anyone actually said Yield was experimental. Quite the opposite infact.

I don't think he thinks anyone did either.

digster wrote:I don't know if I'd call Yield as 'experimental' as the previously two records, but I definitely wouldn't call it a step backwards in any way.

I read that as implying that someone else had called Yield as experimental as the previous records.

Words hey.

I know, right?

To be honest I'm just procrastinating so I'm liable to post up any old shit without reading the previous posts properly. Look out! (I just did a RNDM refernce there too.)