Red Mosquito

I love the band, and think that Ten had great lyrics and after Ten I think their best songs lyrically are probably Elderly Woman and Corduroy...

But man some are just so awful...was just thinking about this while listening to Dissident...

I think it really ruins the later albums. The first 3 were very interesting musically but starting at No Code, and especially Yield the songs seem to become vehicles for Eddie's "poetry" where the music doesn't have much interesting going on and the lyrics are a prime focus and they are cheesy or make no sense <_<.

Was listening to In Hiding and Faithful and the songs sound cool but the lyrics...I dunno Eddie just kind of makes me roll my eyes on Yield. I think it's his fault.

mikejasond wrote:I love the band, and think that Ten had great lyrics and after Ten I think their best songs lyrically are probably Elderly Woman and Corduroy...

But man some are just so awful...was just thinking about this while listening to Dissident...

I think it really ruins the later albums. The first 3 were very interesting musically but starting at No Code, and especially Yield the songs seem to become vehicles for Eddie's "poetry" where the music doesn't have much interesting going on and the lyrics are a prime focus and they are cheesy or make no sense <_<.

Was listening to In Hiding and Faithful and the songs sound cool but the lyrics...I dunno Eddie just kind of makes me roll my eyes on Yield. I think it's his fault.

what band has good lyrics in your opinion? don't say tool

Im not sure I have an example off the top of my head, but something about Eddie's earnestness sometimes just gets uncomfortable lol

mikejasond wrote:Im not sure I have an example off the top of my head, but something about Eddie's earnestness sometimes just gets uncomfortable lol

well, you can think about it for a while, you dont have to answer immediately

They're not awful. They have some really good moments. Maybe they're a little sloppy.

theplatypus wrote:They're not awful. They have some really good moments. Maybe they're a little sloppy.

I think Ten, Vs, and Vitalogy has some good moments, but then it starts coming off as Eddie Vedder's poetry reading from then on...In Hiding, Faithful, No Way, are examples where it becomes pretty awkward - and of course Wishlist. All from yield <_<

No Code is really the downturn to me....Vs had Dissident and Leash that were very awkward but also really good ones like Elderly Woman and Indifference...Rats...I don't know where I fall on that one....But I think overall Ten and Vs and Vitalogy are pretty good.

The low point is Bushleaguer I think....sheesh. That one is hard to listen to.

I think they got better at this in their last two albums surprisingly.

Actually, this forum is named after one of those cheesy lyrics IMO. I don't think it would come off as bad if the music wasn't designed in a way to bring out the lyrics though.

I've never really thought of Ten as being a particularly good album lyrically. It's strengths are elsewhere.

digster wrote:I've never really thought of Ten as being a particularly good album lyrically. It's strengths are elsewhere.

Black has really good lyrics.

I think the issue though is mostly the change in music. Even Flow, Alive, Once, he can sing anything and it sounds badass. The music is so cool. But in Yield the music is designed in such a way that all you really have are Eddie's lyrics in your ear, you can't help but notice them.

Ten's lyrics are very evocative. Guides you to a certain place/feeling. Not everyone has to be Bob Dylan. In fact, that style doesn't usually work for hard(er) rock.

I think Ed's at his best when playing a "character" (DTE, Johnny Guitar) or when he's more elliptical (Last Exit, RVM, Insignificance).

evenslow wrote:Ten's lyrics are very evocative. Guides you to a certain place/feeling. Not everyone has to be Bob Dylan. In fact, that style doesn't usually work for hard(er) rock.

I think Ed's at his best when playing a "character" (DTE, Johnny Guitar) or when he's more elliptical (Last Exit, RVM, Insignificance).

I dunno what elliptical means but yeah these are good...its the ones like the ones I mentioned where it seems like his personal poetry where it starts to be really bad.

mikejasond wrote:

evenslow wrote:Ten's lyrics are very evocative. Guides you to a certain place/feeling. Not everyone has to be Bob Dylan. In fact, that style doesn't usually work for hard(er) rock.

I think Ed's at his best when playing a "character" (DTE, Johnny Guitar) or when he's more elliptical (Last Exit, RVM, Insignificance).

I dunno what elliptical means but yeah these are good...its the ones like the ones I mentioned where it seems like his personal poetry where it starts to be really bad.

Abstract imagery that mirrors the theme or emotion he's writing about, while letting us fill in some of the blanks. Like in Last Exit it's about escape and transformation (among other things), so a cool-ass abstract lyric that follows that line of thinking would be...
let the sun climb, oh, burn 'way my mask
three days, and maybe longer
shed my skin at last

While he's had a fairly sizable dropoff on the last few records, I'd agree that Ed has always been a bit of a spotty or inconsistent lyricist. It's not without exception, but by and large I think PJ's strongest lyrics come from the period of Vitalogy through Binaural.

they're alright

I think Ed has always been strongest with direct observational stories in the third person. I don't think it is necessarily a 'lyric' thing. That approach started to change with Vitalogy and most of No Code is "I" songs. By Yield and Binaural it had gone with a couple of weak exceptions (obviously with lyric contributions from elsewhere as well). Even the third person stories have got weaker as they've been pruned of anything specific. Compare the way Breakerfall and Lightning Bolt are written to Why Go - the lyrics in Why Go aren't amazing but is more direct and effective than the other two. Phrasing and melody is better too.

there's a girl on a ledge, who's got nowhere to turn
because all the love that she had was just wood that she burned
now her life is on fire, it's no one's concern
she can blame the world...or pray til dawn
but only love...can breakerfall

She scratches a letter
Into a wall made of stone
Maybe someday
Another child
Won't feel as alone as she does
It's been two years
And counting
Since they put her in this place
She's been diagnosed
By some stupid fuck
And mommy agrees

She comes on like a stone
But you don't know where from she was thrown
Like a burning meteor from miles high
Looking for a place to land
She said, "Have you got yourself some sand?"
And whatever you replied, she took as yes

At the same time the music moved away from big riff-oriented songs which they did well, but then decided not to like anymore.

The more abstract he goes, the more I like his work. I think Daughter is a great song because it gives us the tiniest details, then a single moment (two lines long), and then it's all character emotions. It doesn't try to explain any more than that. Given to Fly, Gone, or something like Black, by comparison, kind of bore me.

Vitalogy has the majority of my favorite lyrical moments (chief among them Tremor Christ), probably because he was writing too fast and recording too soon after to revise them into any kind of specificity.

Post-Riot Act, he starts taking a much more "professional" approach to writing, and it produces more focused songs (and fewer total clunker moments), but also sounds more detached...more professional. There is a distance and a calculation that wasn't there with the early records.

McParadigm wrote:The more abstract he goes, the more I like his work. I think Daughter is a great song because it gives us the tiniest details, then a single moment (two lines long), and then it's all character emotions. It doesn't try to explain any more than that. Given to Fly, Gone, or something like Black, by comparison, kind of bore me.

Vitalogy has the majority of my favorite lyrical moments (chief among them Tremor Christ), probably because he was writing too fast and recording too soon after to revise them into any kind of specificity.

Post-Riot Act, he starts taking a much more "professional" approach to writing, and it produces more focused songs (and fewer total clunker moments), but also sounds more detached...more professional. There is a distance and a calculation that wasn't there with the early records.

Yes, I think No Code - Riot Act was the worst lyrical period. I agree the emotion and feeling in the first three albums was good and the lyrics stand out. The last 3 albums, I agree its less interesting but doesnt stand out as bad. The music also got more interesting again, less...I dunno...drone-y? The songs feel more cohesive for better or worse, even if not as interesting as their early days.

No Code - Riot Act is the Eddie reading poetry session.

mikejasond wrote:

digster wrote:I've never really thought of Ten as being a particularly good album lyrically. It's strengths are elsewhere.

Black has really good lyrics.

I think the issue though is mostly the change in music. Even Flow, Alive, Once, he can sing anything and it sounds badass. The music is so cool. But in Yield the music is designed in such a way that all you really have are Eddie's lyrics in your ear, you can't help but notice them.

Ten is super cheesy dude. The music, the lyrics, the image, the aesthetic. You don't know what cheesy is. I almost can't listen to Black nowadays because of all the cheese.

Leatherhead wrote:

mikejasond wrote:

digster wrote:I've never really thought of Ten as being a particularly good album lyrically. It's strengths are elsewhere.

Black has really good lyrics.

I think the issue though is mostly the change in music. Even Flow, Alive, Once, he can sing anything and it sounds badass. The music is so cool. But in Yield the music is designed in such a way that all you really have are Eddie's lyrics in your ear, you can't help but notice them.

Ten is super cheesy dude. The music, the lyrics, the image, the aesthetic. You don't know what cheesy is. I almost can't listen to Black nowadays because of all the cheese.

I dunno. I think he pulls it off. Black has very nice lyrics

Leatherhead wrote:

mikejasond wrote:

digster wrote:I've never really thought of Ten as being a particularly good album lyrically. It's strengths are elsewhere.

Black has really good lyrics.

I think the issue though is mostly the change in music. Even Flow, Alive, Once, he can sing anything and it sounds badass. The music is so cool. But in Yield the music is designed in such a way that all you really have are Eddie's lyrics in your ear, you can't help but notice them.

Ten is super cheesy dude. The music, the lyrics, the image, the aesthetic. You don't know what cheesy is. I almost can't listen to Black nowadays because of all the cheese.

Black always cheesed me out