Red Mosquito

malice wrote:he was great friends with cs lewis though. I didn't know he hated the Narnia books.

Yeah, they were great friends and ran The Inklings writing group together, but Tolkien wasn't quiet about his distaste for the Chronicles. He thought that Lewis' approach to Greek, Roman, Christian and Pagan mythology (basically throwing it all in together and not actually exploring any of it in any depth) was clumsy. And he didn't like allegory, so the idea that any of the stories should explicitly symbolise the Christian story was distasteful to him. Never mind that you can also find much of the same Christian symbolism in the Lord of the Rings. To be fair though, allegory goes one further than symbolism because symbolism is less closed to other interpretations.

I mean, the Lord of the Rings was very inspired by the Pilgrim's Progress by John Bunyan, and that's as close to a Christian allegory as you can get.

I don't think Lewis was a big fan of Tolkien's books either. too many elves.

Yeah, I think Tolkien was more into British / Celtic mythology than Lewis, is that right?

The worst thing Tolkien ever said about Lewis was 'he's a typical Ulster Protestant'. (I wasn't aware Lewis was Irish til I read this, though the Brits claim him and can have him)
This was an insult on two levels. One being that Ulster Prods are and always have been relentlessly stiff necked, and the more interesting fact that Tolkien was a devout catholic and rather enjoyed being in Ireland(he 'borrowed' lots of our mythology but none of our language other than one word. Naisc is one Irish word for Ring. Hence Nazgul).

And, he never was asked/answered this but the whole LOTR is really rather religious, Galadriel as the virgin mary(she wasn't a Virgin she's actually Elronds mother in law and Arwen is her granddaughter) Gandalf dying and returning (the resurrection) and Frodo and others facing the great temptation (the ring) and the whole world falling into hell (Sauron) if they succumb. Also the Fellowship as the disciples, Boromir in the role as Judas Iscariot.
Etc etc


I think that's an interpretation that was applied many years later and I don't buy it, but you could look at it that way if you wanted.

The thing with religion in general, and with Christianity I suppose specifically, is its so big and broad that everything can be drawn back to it somehow.

Even the goddamn Batman.

McParadigm wrote:The thing with religion in general, and with Christianity I suppose specifically, is its so big and broad that everything can be drawn back to it somehow.

Even the goddamn Batman.

and the beatles

If only Ringo had changed his name to Peter.

McParadigm wrote:God, the only thing I found less enjoyable than reading the Hobbit was Chronicles. And then some cunt of an elementary school teacher made us eat turkish delight. Shit.

I only read the first book but man did it bother me.


Years later I actually had turkish delight, and my experience was enhanced slightly by years of vaguely wondering what the fuck it was.

stip wrote:

McParadigm wrote:God, the only thing I found less enjoyable than reading the Hobbit was Chronicles. And then some cunt of an elementary school teacher made us eat turkish delight. Shit.

I only read the first book but man did it bother me.


Years later I actually had turkish delight, and my experience was enhanced slightly by years of vaguely wondering what the fuck it was.

Like the real first one? Or the first one?

maybe? I read the lion, the witch, and the wardrobe (which is a really good title for a book)

All i remember is the fat annoying kid and his stupid turkish delight. And a satyr or something.

stip wrote:

McParadigm wrote:God, the only thing I found less enjoyable than reading the Hobbit was Chronicles. And then some cunt of an elementary school teacher made us eat turkish delight. Shit.

I only read the first book but man did it bother me.


Years later I actually had turkish delight, and my experience was enhanced slightly by years of vaguely wondering what the fuck it was.

I thought it was a made up food until harmless told me otherwise

stip wrote:maybe? I read the lion, the witch, and the wardrobe (which is a really good title for a book)

I came into this thread to chit chat lightly about the next movie.

well, more Bean would help it out.

McParadigm wrote:The thing with religion in general, and with Christianity I suppose specifically, is its so big and broad that everything can be drawn back to it somehow.

Even the goddamn Batman.

Especially the goddamn Batman.

McParadigm wrote:well, more Bean would help it out.

The usual complaining about shoehorning Legolas frodo and Galadriel hasn't happened I this thread (cos you're clearly all LOTR novices)

That said, they're presence can be explained. Boromir isn't even born in the years the Hobbit take place in, so please. Do not give Jackson any excuse.

Oh, is that like trying to get the fucking White Witch into every Narnia film?

I've only ever read Lion witch and the wardrobe.

I prefer Tolkien. Lewis' work is all a bit to unfocused and threadbare.